I always figured by now there would be some sort of centralized "trust" entity, ala credit bureaus, where you can build apps on top of that using the same "trust".
Supposing such a thing existed, then drivers could simply offer their own driving services by themselves. Perhaps that's the next evolution here.
I used to drive a pretty boring, but predictable route in the morning and in the late afternoon. I would've loved to drive people who are near my destination both ways, but without anyway to trust them, no way.
Surely someone has tried to implement this before and failed and I just don't know?
That was really common at Microsoft in the late 90s (and may still be) to be able to use the HOV lanes when driving from Redmond to Seattle. It worked well because you were picking up colleagues, which sort of established a certain level of trust.
I don't know how it is now, because I've left since then. But in pre-covid times, Microsoft was pushing/advertising this carpool app they partnered with called Scoop. Similar idea, except it can include workers from other companies as well, and it isn't for making money for the driver, but just to cover the cost of gas + to be able to use the HOV lane.
As a passenger, you schedule your approximate time to go to work (or from work, or both, depending on how you want to use it), and the app matches you with a driver for the next morning who is going to about the same area, but maybe a different building. So they pick you up, drop you off, and go along their merry way, and you are only out of about $5-7 or so (that was the rate for going from Seattle downtown to Redmond, which is about a factor of 6-8 cheaper than an uber/lyft was at the time).
I used it as both a driver (a few times) and as a passenger (many times). Feels like a pretty great idea that worked well. If I was driving, I didn't mind a 5 minute reroute to pick up or drop off someone nearby, and those $7 + (more importantly) HOV lane access were totally worth it. I estimated that the HOV lane access alone saved me significantly more time than I lost by going out of my way to pick up/drop off the passenger. And the fact that those people are guaranteed to not be randos, but either other MSFT employees or employees of other nearby companies made it much more trustworthy for me (the app required work email to sign up).
Obviously, this wasn't meant to be an uber/lyft alternative, as it is only useful for going to/from work and only during specific days/hours. And you gotta schedule/get matched with a driver the night before, you cannot just wake up and spontaneously get a ride. Which makes sense given the context, because people typically want to have their commute to work planned the night before.
My understanding is that it's also still very common in DC's beltway, for similar reasons (lots of civil servants going to similar areas, living nearby each other).
huh. I've never heard of this. thanks for the link. though, what I'm describing ideally could be beyond driving. the same sort of "trust" would also be helpful for selecting someone to take care of your children, clean your house, etc.
I swear this country is going to try to implement all of the worst aspects of China's authoritatiran system and claim it's all 'ok' because it's capitalist and to serve business instead of the govt.
Implementing a Chinese style societal "social credit" system is not a good thing. Even if it would make it a bit cheaper to undercut Uber. Making every action and interation you have in life tracked and rated is not a net plus. The constant visibility and permanance of everything is part of why middle school and high schoolers are having such trouble now. They can't develop as teenagers as they are already part way to living in '1984' with every action tracked via social media.
> The Chinese Communist Party has been constructing a moral ranking system for years that will monitor the behavior of its enormous population — and rank them all based on their "social credit."
> But at the moment the system is piecemeal and voluntary, though the plan is for it to eventually be mandatory and unified across the nation, with each person given their own unique code used to measure their social
credit score in real-time, per Wired.
> The exact methodology is a secret — but examples of infractions include bad driving, smoking in non-smoking zones, buying too many video games, and posting fake news online, specifically about terrorist attacks or airport security.
> Authorities banned people from purchasing flights 17.5 million times by the end of 2018, according to the National Public Credit Information Centre, as the Guardian reported.
> And in July of 2018, a Chinese university denied an incoming student his spot because the student's father had a bad social credit score for failing to repay a loan.
*Please* fellow tech people. Whether you work in ML, DS, or software for a random business or open source project please think through the societal impact and long-run end state of what you propose and produce. We really have to move past the days of "I'm just an engineer I'll only focus on the tech and ignore the impact of my work on society". Implementing China's societal wide social credit system is a bad path. And of course the argument will be, "well anyone who doesn't want to use it doesn't have to". And then that will turn into, "well most companies offer discounts if you use it." Then to "well most companies offer higher rates if you don't use it". Then "most companies won't serve you if you don't use it". Then it's universal in society just as if govt mandated, but people will consider it less horrific because it was slipery slope implemented vs via a mandate.
Through a credit system that is centralized, just like China's credit system. Except it's not even run by elected officials so there's no representation.
it's a terrible idea and Boiled Cabbage makes a very good point
The issue is that, while there's certainly reason to be worried about something like China's system, there's always going to some amount of ad-hoc or official systems of trust. Criminal background checks, sex offender registries, credit reports, professional licensing, your eBay buyer/seller rating, your religion, and whether or not someone looking at you just thinks you look creepy.
It's certainly reasonable to think a system as massive and in-depth as what China is working on is too far, but the alternative in the far extreme is just looking at someone and going "do I trust this person", which isn't a great solution either, and is prone to the "you don't look like you're from around here" sorts of defaults.
As with most things, the question isn't "should this exist at all". There will always be some sort of explicit or implicit system of trust. The question is where do you draw the lines between something like China's system and randomly picking someone and hoping they don't have a history of serious crimes/don't even know how to do whatever you need them to do. There's plenty of existing systems I think go too far, but I also would want to know that the person picking me up for a car trip had a driver's license.
So you're against the idea of Uber, eBay, Care, Lyft, etc? Since what I'm describing already exists. Not to mention the credit bureaus. You'd prefer arbitrariness? If anything a single place for the trust would be better as it would be more thoroughly examined.
Dating apps retain liability and ban people. Not to mention using a dating app does not inherently imply a physical meetup like using an Uber. Not to mention with dating apps you can get them yourself.
There was Waze carpool, which I used as a passenger. It was not meant to be profitable as a source of income for drivers, but helped cover the cost of gas and such. I don’t remember the exact sign up requirements but both the driver and rider had a decision in who to pick up, when and where. Not sure if it’s still in existence but it sounds like it would be worth a look for you.
At one point, I think people did this crossing the Bay Bridge in SF. It didn't need a VC-funded startup with a bunch of expensive engineers though. I think people just parked in a known location and people pooled.
I remember there being signs on Spear St at Folsom with specific destinations for carpools. I can see them on Google Street View in 2021, but they appear to be removed in 2022. (or maybe they're designated on the paper you can't read on street view right now?)
A chicken and egg problem of data acquisition. If I'm a user, why would I share data to such a service without concrete services to unlock? If I'm a service provider, why would I pay for a service without users?
Really such data is obtained only by service providers, credit bureaus being an edge case. And if I've built a service that acquires such data, why would I sell it rather than build more services to sell?
Hey, BlaBlaCar Daily engineer here. This still is an attempt we are running in France, now with thousands of trips happening every day. When did you use it? Perhaps if you give it another try you may find someone this time. :)
I also would love to hear your feedback. What do you think we should do to improve the experience of drivers and passengers, and to get more people to share their commute?
Yeah, that's the biggest challenge, kickstarting specific regions. Oftentimes at first there are drivers but no passengers or vice-versa.
What you can do is set your commute and leave the app installed in the background. Others can send requests to you once they join or the app can eventually remind you that there are others along your route.
I used to do that with QuickRide in Bangalore. Very popular and fairly simple to use. As a rider, you can put up your origin and destination points. You are shown people with cars who have a high overlap with your origin-destination route and you can send them requests to join.
Usually 1/4th the price of a cab and the app has information about where each rider/car owner works (mostly MNCs), that works as a trust factor.
I guess, but would I rather just click on an app when I need a ride or call some guy (who may or may not pick up) to see if he's available (may or may not be) at a given time (I guess I call a few hours ahead).
And if he's not available, I guess I just open the app and request a ride? Easier to just do that from the start?
I garuntee you the reliability of the Uber network of drivers is higher than a single person who may be asleep when you need them.
I've lived in NYC and I've lived in < 2k person remote towns where business card drivers are more common than a Lyft. Trying to deal with the individuals in the small towns is always a nightmare
Sure, but they solve different needs. If I'm in a random location and need a car now? Easier to use Uber/Lyft. If I know I'm going to need to be picked up after a concert when surge pricing is going to be brutal? Much easier to call a driver friend ahead of time and offer them cash to be ready to pick me up at a set location.
Supposing such a thing existed, then drivers could simply offer their own driving services by themselves. Perhaps that's the next evolution here.
I used to drive a pretty boring, but predictable route in the morning and in the late afternoon. I would've loved to drive people who are near my destination both ways, but without anyway to trust them, no way.
Surely someone has tried to implement this before and failed and I just don't know?