I get the point of this article and its tongue in cheek. Twenty years ago people laughed at electric cars with their maybe 30-40 miles of range and 8-12hour charging times. Tesla has done a lot to iron out most of these engineering problems and I applaud them for that. However, articles like this also smack of elitism, especially considering the 6 figure prices most Tesla vehicles sell for. I would love to own a Tesla, just as I would love to own a 2000 acre ranch estate with a huge mansion on it. When electric cars can compete in the range of commodity cars, then we can have this conversation about the merits of electric cars.
I just watched a video comparing the Dodge Charger Hellcat to a Tesla P-85d. Both have similar power, and while you can debate the level of quality of FCA vs Tesla you can still drive a Hellcat(which is an insane gas guzzler) for less money for 5-7 years depending on your yearly mileage. At that point, most people will likely purchase a new vehicle, and that is also assuming you only use free superchargers. A Tesla is definitely a luxury item, I get that, and there are other options. The problem is most current other options are more like the electric cars 20 years ago than a tesla.
Progress is being made and I am excited about that. I would love to have an electric commuter car as long as it could meet the following criteria.
1) seat 5 people comfortably
2) have 150+ miles of range(I drive about 120 miles per day)
3) cost between 30-50k
4) have reasonable performance(say comparable to a german sedan in that price range)
5) recharge quickly and easily, possibly have battery swap capability for the high use days
6) emphasize being a good car and not a "green" car. Im all for taking care of the environment, but will never buy a car with a 60" x 12" GREEN ECO ELECTRIC POWER emblazoned across the side.(In the same way I would never get a car that says "UBER HEMI BIG WANG POWER" either)
7) be reliable and comfortable to drive, with low cost of ownership at least comparable to a reliable petrol car.
I dont think any of that list is unreasonable, and I am glad that Tesla exists, they have done a great service to the electric car.
Your points are very reasonable. However, I think that unless some government funds electric car tech research, the only way is to approach it top down, in a capitalist model. Make an electric car that's expensive, with a very high profit margin. Sell it to the rich. Use the profits to drive the tech advancement. If you approach it by making affordable cars, it will be quite a while before you accumulate enough capital to invest in the technology.
They had one at 53k and another at 55k last week, but those went quick. If you're serious about going electric, keep tabs on that report. You should be able to snag a deal in your price range. The Model S checks off everything on your list except price, and it's just barely out of that range at that.
"the 6 figure price most Tesla vehicles sell for" - really? You're right that they're a luxury item, but let's be accurate here. Only the top-of-the-line performance model is $105k, and that's before tax credits which bring it back down to five figures. The entry model is $75k, and the midrange is $85k.
You're correct, but we're not comparing car prices.
The original claim was that being able to pay six figures for a car puts the purchaser in rare company. For the sake of that argument, it doesn't matter where the six figures come from.
I looked for a breakdown of Tesla sales, but could not find anything. I am pretty sure that it is accurate to say the majority of Tesla Model S's on the road are 6 figure vehicles.
I know this is anecdotal, but here in the Houston area, I would say the breakdown of Model S vehicles on the road are about 5% P65, 65% P85, and the rest P85D/S/+. Now, Im sure there are people who bought the stripped down P65 with no options. However, Most of these P85s are loaded, and a quick glance at the Tesla motors site shows that a 70 will cost you 76,750 base and 91,250 loaded (+ 1200 dest®ulation fee.) A 85/D will cost you 81,750 base and loaded is over 101,250. Cars like the ones most magazines test are fully loaded top of the line models. The sticker on the P85D in the video vs the charger hellcat was 129k. Sure you can get one in the 75-90k range, but most on the road are not going to be equipped that way.
This is just the nature of the car business(even a disrupted one). People want options, and base price is rarely what gets delivered, there is just too much profit to be had from options.
I am not saying this to deride Tesla, but lets call the model S what it really is, a 100k electric car with great performance.
You might be a bit mixed up on the Tesla lineup. The P models are the high-end performance versions (the P is for "performance"). There's no such thing as a stripped-down P Tesla. There was never a 65 of any variety. There was a 60, but there was never a P60. Right now the lineup is 70D, 85, 85D, P85D. (The D being for "Dual motor" i.e. all wheel drive.) Previously there was a 60 instead of the 70D. Long ago there was a 40, but it got discontinued almost instantaneously.
My own anecdotal experience is that virtually every Tesla on the road is an 85, with 85D starting to supplant it now, and the 70D probably going to start taking that crown once it ships.
I bought my 85 with lots of reasonable/useful options (tech package, sunroof, rear seats) but without the frilly stuff (high-end sound system, "premium interior") and it was comfortably under $100,000 even without counting the federal tax credit.
I wouldn't object too strenuously to rounding my price up to "100k" as part of discussions like this, though.
My mistake, I knew P stood for performance so just a typo. Its been so long since Ive seen the 60 that I couldnt remember the model designation. Either way, I still think my argument stands as reasonable...
It most definitely is a luxury item, but not high-end luxury; it's interesting how the sales corrolate with the price. If you look at Scandinavia, the Model S is around the same price as a BMW 5 series and people go "OMG! WANTS!", whereas in the UK with essentially zero subsidies it competes with Aston Martins or the Maserati Ghibli and the posh people go "Bah, no thanks".
This is exactly what I thought when I read this. It's incredibly pretentious and doesn't come off well.
That said, electric cars are more accessible than ever. The leaf starts at only $21000, which is in the range of most new-car buyers.
The real problem is the lack of diversity. There are very expensive electric sedans like the Teslas and the i8, and then there is the leaf and plug-in prius. But, there are not downmarket electric compact sedans, minivans and true SUVs. If you want an electric vehicle, you either have to shell out $800 a month or get stuck with an odd-looking hatchback. I really hope manufacturers begin rolling out new form factors for their EVs sooner rather than later.
Well the other problem is that many electric cars assume you have the facilities to charge them on your own. Home ownership should not be a precondition for car ownership.
Certainly I could _afford_ a Leaf or a Tesla if I wanted to make room for the payments. I'm more concerned how to charge it if I don't own a garage, and I'm sort of grossed out by how nearly all literature on the subject just totally glosses this over.
To the extent that 1) cities allow designating street parking for EV vehicles in residential areas, 2) that vehicles standardize on charging texhnology, 3) that the cost of building a charging station can be amortized over the useful life, I think that you will see on-street charging options for your EV.
With the right level of standardization and getting some of the costier components inside the car instead of at each outlet, I wonder how much it costs to embed an outlet in the asphalt right next to a parking space, if you were wiring say, 100,000 residential street parking spaces?
Very true. I live in a a city where there are quite a few places to charge, but I imagine that there are millions of people who would be interested in an EV but don't have access to the infrastructure.
I agree. If this were written by a Nissan Leaf blog it would come off far more proletariat and I'm not sure any of it would have to be changed (except the bit about the frunk).
They're not really there yet, though; right now it seems like Tesla's still raising capital via the Model S and (eventually) the Model X. A significantly-cheaper Tesla (which probably ain't the Model X) will probably arrive alongside the new battery-churning Gigafactory they're building here in Reno (since that'll allow for better economies of scale with the batteries at least), which is slated for completion by around 2017 IIRC.
> I just watched a video comparing the Dodge Charger Hellcat to a Tesla P-85d. Both have similar power, and while you can debate the level of quality of FCA vs Tesla you can still drive a Hellcat(which is an insane gas guzzler) for less money for 5-7 years depending on your yearly mileage.
Was that for US prices of fossil fuels? While I don't know about Sweden (where this article appears to have been written), but compared to prices in the Netherlands, in the US gasoline is about 2-3x as cheap (at least, last time I checked, I don't own a car so I don't keep quite as close an eye on these prices).
Or compare for yourself (today's average Dutch price is 1.735 euro per liter):
If you can accept plug in hybrid as electric there are tons of good options matching almost all your criteria, Audi, Mercedes, BWM, Lexus, Volvo, VW, Toyota(more than just prius) etc etc, all have plug in hybrid variants of their normal cars. All without any big stickers, that's probably why you haven't even realized that they exist out on the roads :)
Hybrids also have the benefit of always fulfilling criteria 2 and 5, which pure electric simply don't.
Also, the Model III should be more affordable as well, and get close to matching your criteria...seating 5 people "comfortably" is arguable with most sedans and crossovers though. However, I haven't heard much about it since the initial announcements: http://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/a12983/35000-tesla-mode...
The calculations in Sweden (where the author/s are) are entirely different. The Tesla isn't a luxury item there, and you can't drive a small cheap car for equivalent price, since the taxes and gasoline costs are so high.
The Tesla is definitely a luxury item here in Sweden. I drive a Renault diesel and I could buy three of those for the price of a Tesla (yeah, I know, apples/oranges...) TCO for a Tesla will (sadly) be a lot higher than for a fossil fuel car, simply because of the high purchase price.
Take a look at the VW e-Golf. It retails for $34k, seats 5, is still VERY fun to drive with great performance. However, it will fail on your range and charging time requirements. For a shorter commute I think it might work pretty well for you.
My list is almost identical to yours, but I need range more in the 300-400 mile range, in short an electric mid size or large sedan - I drive a crown victoria now, and would be looking for something similar.
I just watched a video comparing the Dodge Charger Hellcat to a Tesla P-85d. Both have similar power, and while you can debate the level of quality of FCA vs Tesla you can still drive a Hellcat(which is an insane gas guzzler) for less money for 5-7 years depending on your yearly mileage. At that point, most people will likely purchase a new vehicle, and that is also assuming you only use free superchargers. A Tesla is definitely a luxury item, I get that, and there are other options. The problem is most current other options are more like the electric cars 20 years ago than a tesla.
Progress is being made and I am excited about that. I would love to have an electric commuter car as long as it could meet the following criteria.
1) seat 5 people comfortably 2) have 150+ miles of range(I drive about 120 miles per day) 3) cost between 30-50k 4) have reasonable performance(say comparable to a german sedan in that price range) 5) recharge quickly and easily, possibly have battery swap capability for the high use days 6) emphasize being a good car and not a "green" car. Im all for taking care of the environment, but will never buy a car with a 60" x 12" GREEN ECO ELECTRIC POWER emblazoned across the side.(In the same way I would never get a car that says "UBER HEMI BIG WANG POWER" either) 7) be reliable and comfortable to drive, with low cost of ownership at least comparable to a reliable petrol car.
I dont think any of that list is unreasonable, and I am glad that Tesla exists, they have done a great service to the electric car.