Related but an off-shoot question, people who are "settled down," in your late 20's/30's/40's/50's/60's, have families and various obligations, how do you deal with loneliness?
As someone who is on the precipice of turning 30 (27 currently), speaking strictly for myself - I've found that loneliness for me and my older peers is different from the angst of adolescence a la Holden. Tbh, younger people tend to think in more black and white terms and very ambitious but most haven't gone through the "test" of one's vulnerability and limitation. Unfortunately, we also live in a marketing society that sells products and dreams on the Fear of Missing Out (FOMO) that exploit the impressionable young people (e.g., the "MTV" high school memories with the "Coke" concert experience with friends; the "Ivy League" class room experience, the "Liberal Arts" self-exploration, the "Sexy-Times" with la-femme-de-Zooey Deschanel and "Peter Thiel/Steve Jobs entrepreneur" iconoclasm).
Whereas I was a jack-ass when I was 21, thinking I was special and therefore deserved and expected external tokens of accomplishments at every stage in my life (I was crestfallen at age 21 after being rejected by YC because I couldn't post a smug post on FB to snub all of my classmates and friends; and most importantly, have that as a validation to my insecure self-worth; a loneliness stemming out of FOMO). My loneliness nowadays is more centered around the splintering of between mine and my friends and acquaintances' goals and vision.
Some of my friends are still going at it with early twenties vision of grad school, startups and traveling, albeit with some bruises and splints. Some of my friends have fully "embraced" adulthood, complete with jumbo mortgage loans and X month into pregnancy and parenting books and diapers. Friendships/liasons have changed from one-on-one interaction to couples or single "dating" another couple or single. But most alarmingly, how much less I care and am affected by my peers' ideas and vision because how much I've fully embraced my own vulnerabilities/personality and focused fully to vest on my own ideas.
People who have past their 20's, how do you deal with loneliness? Do you focus on your family or really close friends after twenties, or do you focus on pursuing your own ideas with a community of likely-minded people, or do you come up with some kind of philosophical reconciliation?
I'm 31. I was 25 when I got married, which was also the same year the company I co-founded hit the skids and eventually a brick wall. That first year was really rough on us (we started with 1 child and had another in the middle of that year), but we survived and watching that company burn was one of the most valuable life lessons I've ever had. We've had another two kids since then, and I've learned a few other things along the way.
Before I was married, all of those fears and anxieties ruled my life. I think that's partly what attracted me to the startup world and ultimately to starting that company. I wanted to chase my ambitions and fight that feeling of loneliness. However, the great lesson I learned from that company, and ultimately from the last few years of marriage and kids is that you won't be alone when you choose to value the people you love over achievements you earn, stuff you buy, or even just stuff you work really hard on. I poured it on with the 90 and 100 hour weeks the last 6 months of that company and in the end the company crumbled and my hard work left me with nothing but bitterness toward my creation (I eventually got past the bitterness). Today I invest that time in my wife and my kids, and they are my world to me. They're my best friends. There's no earning their love, but the time I spend with them is never wasted. I don't get through the week, having prioritized them over other things, and think to myself "man, I really wish I'd spent an extra 20 hours on that personal project" that will never do anything for my personal fulfillment beyond some temporary ego boost.
Now. That's not to say I don't still love the startup and technology world. I do. And I still have those personal projects. And that professional community. I also love working hard on stuff that pushes the envelope. But the funny thing is that ever since I put that part of myself in a bounded box I've enjoyed it more and been more productive. There isn't the sense of having to keep up, and yet I'm still able to. Consequently I'm happier at work and since I don't draw my personal worth from it, I can take setbacks and move on and still enjoy it.
I don't know that everyone should get married, but it seems to me that, based on everyone I've ever known, that you best fight loneliness by surrounding yourself with people who will stick by you regardless of job, religion, social status , health, or anything else. To me, the question to ask is - if the world fell apart right now, would the people you prioritize still be with you?
Thanks so much for sharing your perspective. You've put words to some half-formed thoughts I've been having since a recently failed relationship. Live and learn
> As someone who is on the precipice of turning 30 (27 currently), speaking strictly for myself - I've found that loneliness for me and my older peers is different from the angst of adolescence a la Holden.
Absolutely. Also I think it varies by age. When you are in your 60's, retiring, kids have grown and left, etc. I think that's one of the most lonely times in the lives of Americans. I watch my wife's grandmother who lives with various children as is convenient for them, and she may not have a permanent home or a lot of stuff of her own, but she is happier than most Americans I have seen in retirement. Having watched my own grandparents struggle with loneliness in retirement despite the fact that we have a reasonably close family by American standards is one of the reasons why I am relatively adamant that independent retirement is not a good thing. But having lived in both kinds of cultures, I don't think most of my fellow Americans are ready to make the tradeoffs that this would involve.
> Do you focus on your family or really close friends after twenties, or do you focus on pursuing your own ideas with a community of likely-minded people, or do you come up with some kind of philosophical reconciliation?
Yes to all three. But I think there is also a feeling when you are in your 20's that if you find that special someone you won't be lonely anymore. Well, that never really happens. So you start having a family, your social life constricts, and you find you are still lonely. What you have to do is find communities of like-minded people who you can work with, and you also have to come to terms with the fact that having other people may be necessary to prevent loneliness but it is not sufficient, and at some point you have to learn to focus on what you have instead of what you don't.
Do make sure to keep a few of the closest relationships current, despite the growing obstacles. Make the time, find the resources, ignore the inconveniences.
Instead of surface-level 'interactions' of liking their picture on facebook, spend a focused afternoon or weekend together even if it now takes, say, 100+miles of driving. If your life or their lives have changed - adapt. If one of you is single and another has a few kids, this will mean a very different focus in everyday life - but if that causes your relations to fade away, you all lose in the end, so ensure that it doesn't happen.
If you can't maintain quality relationships with X people anymore due to changes in your lifestyle and time availability - prioritize. If you let things just go their own way, it will result in shallow relationships with X people (and you'll feel lonely as the orignal article states), but you should rather have deep relations with X/2 people instead, you just have to choose.
Me, I just accept the suffering. With my interest in entrepreneurship and technology I have drifted apart from most of my friends (who spend their time with kids and hobbies nowadays) and never really became close with anyone in the startup community - everyone seems too busy with their own stuff to pay attention to others.
And just wave away, via cognitive dissonance, the fact that the kids you produce are likely to be badly fucked over by climate change and an overpopulated world in their lifetime?
There have been several mass extinction events in the last 500 million years that resulted in the disappearance of the majority of animal life. We're here today through the virtue of our (500 million years of) ancestors who picked up, moved on, and got right back to fucking. They probably weren't enjoying half-starving and watching their children die, but they kept at it. Biological imperative doesn't give a shit.
I up-voted you. So many people -- including people prone to gloominess -- seem to reproduce without thinking of the fact that they are forcing another human into existence who may not enjoy life very much.
As someone who is on the precipice of turning 30 (27 currently), speaking strictly for myself - I've found that loneliness for me and my older peers is different from the angst of adolescence a la Holden. Tbh, younger people tend to think in more black and white terms and very ambitious but most haven't gone through the "test" of one's vulnerability and limitation. Unfortunately, we also live in a marketing society that sells products and dreams on the Fear of Missing Out (FOMO) that exploit the impressionable young people (e.g., the "MTV" high school memories with the "Coke" concert experience with friends; the "Ivy League" class room experience, the "Liberal Arts" self-exploration, the "Sexy-Times" with la-femme-de-Zooey Deschanel and "Peter Thiel/Steve Jobs entrepreneur" iconoclasm).
Whereas I was a jack-ass when I was 21, thinking I was special and therefore deserved and expected external tokens of accomplishments at every stage in my life (I was crestfallen at age 21 after being rejected by YC because I couldn't post a smug post on FB to snub all of my classmates and friends; and most importantly, have that as a validation to my insecure self-worth; a loneliness stemming out of FOMO). My loneliness nowadays is more centered around the splintering of between mine and my friends and acquaintances' goals and vision.
Some of my friends are still going at it with early twenties vision of grad school, startups and traveling, albeit with some bruises and splints. Some of my friends have fully "embraced" adulthood, complete with jumbo mortgage loans and X month into pregnancy and parenting books and diapers. Friendships/liasons have changed from one-on-one interaction to couples or single "dating" another couple or single. But most alarmingly, how much less I care and am affected by my peers' ideas and vision because how much I've fully embraced my own vulnerabilities/personality and focused fully to vest on my own ideas.
People who have past their 20's, how do you deal with loneliness? Do you focus on your family or really close friends after twenties, or do you focus on pursuing your own ideas with a community of likely-minded people, or do you come up with some kind of philosophical reconciliation?