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[dupe] Microsoft Is Removing Xbox One DRM (kotaku.com)
48 points by rkudeshi on June 19, 2013 | hide | past | favorite | 34 comments



This is a pretty bold move by them. They're essentially getting rid of all the changes to the DRM set up from the 360 (which also has DRM; this isn't a complete removal), including all the beneficial changes. Of course, they weren't that compelling to me and introduced a lot of confusion about how they would work and exactly what limitations would be put in place.

Looks like they're still going to struggle with the Kinect privacy concerns, but that's more of a PR battle than an actual privacy one. You can turn off Kinect, but you couldn't turn off the Xbox DRM system.


> Looks like they're still going to struggle with the Kinect privacy concerns

I can't help but wonder. Of all of the issues with the XB1, that one seems like my candidate for biggest disconnect between what people say online and what popular perception actually is. I know I don't care, nor do any of my gamer friends, nor my brother.


Do you own an iPad or a laptop with a web cam and microphone?


iPads and laptops aren't sitting there, listening to everything you say, waiting for you to say 'xbox, on!'. It listens to everything you say while waiting for that one command (like Glass, too). It'd be easy to give someone a hook for that audio stream, given the right motivations.


"Always on" is a price I'm willing to pay for fully voice-controlled functionality. If someone looks at the power usage and network activity of the XB1/Kinect and determines there is something untoward then that will give me pause, but at the present I'm not going to run from the technology because I think Microsoft is trying to record all of my actions.


Not with one that's active 100% of the time.

Which may not be completely accurate, the XB1 mic is on all the time by default, but I'm not sure about the camera. The benefit of my laptop webcam though is the hardware light built in to indicate when it's active.


Some of those hardware lights can actually be controlled from software, unfortunately.


I'm guessing your brother is little, not big ;-)


Bold? More like desperate. Not doing this would have killed Xbox.


I'm not all that thrilled about this. I wanted to see where Microsoft would go with this. It would have been great if we could transition to a pricing and distribution model similar to Steam. I saw this as a step towards weening console players off of physical media.


The difference is that Steam has to compete with other online retailers as well as hard media. Consoles are more of a captive audience... obviously some folks have multiple consoles, but most of the core audience will only be buying one console at launch. So even if MS grossly undercuts the competition in their e-shop like Steam does, game prices don't appear to be a big point of competition in the console-vs-console war. And either way, developers doing cross-platform releases don't let Steam do those kind of deep cuts on new titles. If they're only reaping the benefits on older games? That could be a hard battle to win.


I don't believe Steam has their crazy sales with the primary focus being on undercutting competition. Generally, the sales are for slightly older games (1 year or older). These games have likely seen a dramatic drop in sales. Even as low as Steam reduces the price point to, I'm willing to bet the revenue bump is huge. It's an effective way to derive profits from otherwise low volume titles.

"Instead what we saw was our gross revenue increased by a factor of 40. Not 40 percent, but a factor of 40." http://www.geekwire.com/2011/experiments-video-game-economic...


Steam's sales have nothing to do with competition and everything to do with leveraging digital distribution and maximizing benefit for everyone, including publishers.

MS might be too wedded to old norms to understand that being able to lower prices can actually dramatically increase total revenue in a digital world but Valve very much does.

Here, read this: http://www.geekwire.com/2011/experiments-video-game-economic...

That's some background about Valve's early experiments with Steam sales. Early on their preliminary research indicated that sales would pretty much leave total revenue unchanged, with the increase in purchases balanced by the reduced per-game revenue. However, they found out quickly they were very wrong. What they found was that with a 75% reduction in price their total revenue increased by 40 times. Not 40%, a factor of 40, 4000%. And not sales volume, total revenue. Which translates to much higher profit in the digital realm where per-sale overhead is small.

Game makers and publishers who actually understand economics, instead of companies like MS who merely pretend to, have the opportunity to greatly advantage both consumers and game makers. Cheaper games means more people can play them, but it turns out it also means more money in the hands of people who make games. Which helps those companies survive and makes it that much more possible for them to make more games.


How would this have moved the pricing meter at all? Major games are available for download on PS3 and Xbox 360 and they cost the same/more than physical media!

Looking at similar markets, movies cost about the same for a physical copy as they do on Google Play, books tend to cost the same digitally as they do physically, CDs cost about $11, which is what albums tend to cost on Play.

Basically I don't buy that argument. I wish I could, it's a great idea - and only fair considering the lack of transferability and the fact that there is no truck driving goods cross country to get them to me.


It would have been unlikely they would have adopted Steam's pricing structure with a mix of physical and digital distribution, but it would have been far more feasible if it was full digital.

Your comparison to similar markets may be valid, however if you're familiar with Steam (a far more direct comparison) and their sales, you'd know that radical pricing changes are possible. It's fairly common for major titles to go on sale for $2.50 - $5.00. I just got an email last week that said The Witcher 2 was on sale for $6.79.

I don't know for sure that Microsoft would have gone down this route, but deprecating physical media would have been a step in the right direction.


> but it would have been far more feasible if it was full digital.

How so? I don't see the difference. Most of the games in my Steam library I could also have purchased on Amazon and received a disc within 2 days.


Why would console players want to be weened off, given the advantages they have? Ease of trading/reselling. Put the disk in and play. No need to bring your console to a friend's house to play.

If the price is the same, I prefer physical media on the PC as well. I still feel cheated that Skyrim required a Steam activation.


Well that's the thing. The old authentication scheme would have you log in to your friend's Xbox One and then you have access to your entire game collection.

No need to lug anything to your friend's house. It all happens in the cloud.


You are assuming that there is a fast internet connection available at all times. If I put a disk into the console, I can play it immediately. If I start a download of a 2-layer DVD's content, 9.4 GB, then that is 10 hours to download it at a 2 Mbps connection. Even on a 25 Mbps connection, that is 50 minutes. These times aren't prohibitive if you have just bought a game and are downloading it overnight, but they are not sufficient to have it immediately ready.

Or, consider a LAN party. 5 people each bring their consoles, and 3 games per person. Using disks, you put whatever disk into whatever console, and start playing. Using download-only games, you need to wait until the correct console is available to use.


IIRC, the Xbox One has a similar download scheme as PS4, in which it will download while you play. So you'd be up and running before the whole thing is downloaded.


I'm focusing more on the pricing model that Steam has. Sure, physical media has its benefits, but I'd give them all up for the equivalent of Steam Sales on Xbox. To be fair, I never trade or resell my games anyway.

http://cdn.leviathyn.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/steam_sa...


True enough. The sales on Steam are what make the DRM be bearable. That said, should the DRM become intrusive, or should Valve go out of business, I feel no moral requirement to pay for the game again in a different medium instead of pirating it.


As I've said elsewhere, there's no reason MS can't have the best of both worlds. A disc-based ecosystem and a digital, online based ecosystem can co-exist peacefully.


"Thank you again for your candid feedback. Our team remains committed to listening, taking feedback and delivering a great product for you later this year."

Translated: "Please stop telling us to burn in the 9 circles of Hell. Our team would also like it if you stopped threatening their families."


I am more sad at all the potential advances that have been lost / delayed:

    These changes will impact some of the scenarios we previously
    announced for Xbox One. The sharing of games will work as it does today,
    you will simply share the disc. Downloaded titles cannot be shared
    or resold. Also, similar to today, playing disc based games will
    require that the disc be in the tray
The last thing that next-gen consoles need is to remain anchored to last-gen practices. The road was going to be bumpy but, as many have said before, so was Steam and now everyone loves what it's become.


They forgot to turn off the telescreen though...

i.e. it won't boot without the Kinect plugged in.


Good move, but I can still see the one becoming this generations Wii. Sort-of gaming system mixed up with home entertainment and novelty controllers...going up against the PS4 which has similar guts but is designed as a no-compromise gaming system. The Wii did OK to begin with, but was then smashed by 360, I suspect the PS4 will do same to One.


WOW, maybe the hope of DRM being redefined as Dynamic Response Marketing over the more common Digital Rights Managment (We not only know what you did last summer but can dictate all yoru summers), has hope.

If anything it shows a more consumer responsive Microsoft, which can't be a bad thing.


Next all we need is for the government to do an about face for the things people are fussing over!


> "Xbox One games will be playable on any Xbox One console — there will be no regional restrictions."

this is pretty big


Not really. It's the norm on Sony consoles since the PS2.


Is this totally confirmed? This seems hoax-y to me right now.



[deleted]


That FAQ is from last month. The update from today specifically states:

> After a one-time system set-up with a new Xbox One, you can play any disc based game without ever connecting online again. There is no 24 hour connection requirement and you can take your Xbox One anywhere you want and play your games, just like on Xbox 360.

http://news.xbox.com/2013/06/update




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