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Injustice means one thing for me and another for someone living in China. I have no idea what the standard of living is over there for a typical factory worker. Is it better or worse than the alternatives? I don't know. Foxconn could be a pioneer of beter living and working conditions for the country and I'd never know it. I'm biased towards a first world view on these matters. Everything must be considered when doing these types of comparisons, but there is no comparison here, just an editorial on how deplorable working conditions are. Again, at Foxconn in China. I assume Foxconn factories aren't this way in other countries with better labor laws.

My stance is that this is an issue the government needs to resolve. It's unreasonable to expect Apple or Foxconn to do anything about this on their own accord. I doubt they are behaving any differently than any other company with manufacturing operations over there. There's no need to crucify Apple or Foxconn over this.




Injustice means one thing for me and another for a negro. I have no idea what the standard of living is for typical negros. Is it better or worse than the alternatives? I don't know. Confederate cotton farmers could be a pioneer of better living and working conditions for negros I'd never know it. I'm biased towards a Union view on these matters. Everything must be considered when doing these types of comparisons, but there is no comparison here, just an editorial on how deplorable working conditions are. Again, on confederate cotton farms. I assume cotton farms aren't this way all over the country. My stance is that this is an issue the government needs to resolve. It's unreasonable to expect cotton farmers or t-shirt manufacturers to do anything about this on their own accord. I doubt they are behaving any differently than any other company with cotton manufacturing operations. There's no need to crucify cotton farmers or t-shirt manufacturers over this.

Sounds kinda ridiculous when you change a coupla words, no?


The situation for slavery in America was resolved only because of civil war. For the problems that exist in China, the Chinese government's number one fear is that something similar could happen because they can't fix their problems any other way. And while ignorant people in the west may cheer and comment that it's necessary to break a few eggs to make an omelette, that is not a situation that would be considered preferable by any means for anybody.

I always see a lot of people complaining about Foxconn and the like, but nobody offering any solutions that would actually work. It's especially annoying when they don't acknowledge exactly why the problem is so difficult to solve, considering all the political, economic, social, and technological trends that contribute to the problem. IMO, those who criticize the problem, but can't offer any viable solutions, should at least put their money where their mouth is and not contribute to the problem. This means they shouldn't buy any electronics or in fact, shouldn't buy many things. Most stuff is made in China these days, or other countries with similar lax issues.

It's a complicated issue, and I see too much straw man applied to this issue too many times.

Living here, I realize most people have no idea how poor the vast majority of people are in China. I had no idea until I came here. I'm not saying the situation is acceptable. I am saying the situation is too complicated for the commentary we see over and over again.


You're comparing impoverished people taking jobs of their own free will to chattel slavery?


Rural migrant workers in China (who make up the bulk of factory labour) have less rights than people who are residents of the area they are working in. For one, it is very hard (near impossible) for migrant workers to send their children to schools near their workplace. As for free will, you will find many who move to the cities for these jobs are doing so under intense family pressure.

I'm not trying to draw a comparison to slavery, there is actual slavery in Southern China's brick making industry that is truly appalling.


If, as you say, they're impoverished, how free is their will?

Are they 90% free? 50%?


100%. It's not the number or attractiveness of options that make you unfree, it's the guy with the rifle who shoots you if you "quit".


Poverty is the state of nature.


Your railing on this article undermines your whole point. You say that you lack perspective as to what the living conditions are in different Chinese factories -- but you fail to recognize that this article gives you one more data point than you previously had. You gain perspective by having more articles bringing these issues to light a little at a time.

It is also worth noting that the article in question was originally written by a news agency from Shanghai -- it is not an American, outsider-perspective that's painting a scathing picture, it's the Chinese themselves with their own experiences.


> Injustice means one thing for me and another for someone living in China.

Why? That standards of living are higher in some places than others is no reason to be negative about attempts to change the status quo. Drawing attention to this has resulted in improvements, even if there's a long way to go. People always want things to be someone else's problem. The good news is that, looking at history, these things usually get better over time.

> There's no need to crucify Apple or Foxconn over this.

These are their own workers. They are directly responsible for the conditions in their own factories. The notion that it's China, so it's reasonable to expect them to be treated like crap doesn't sit well with me. That may be how things are in much of China, but it says nothing about how things ought to be in China. You could complain that if so, they ought to improve things, but that's exactly what they are doing here: bringing the issues to light so they can be dealt with.




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