We're on a tech forum known to have some of the best and brightest and visited by tech giants. If anyone can solve this problem, it is us. If we are the ones giving up, then who is there to make things right?
As I see it, our only choice is to make privacy and anonymity trivial. Not for techies, but for our tech illiterate grandparents. Push hard for tools like Signal where people can get encryption without having to think about encryption. People want privacy and security but they just don't know how or don't understand what leaks data. But there's the clear irony that the sector __we__ are critical to is the one who is creating this problem.
I'm not ready to swallow that pill. I'm unconvinced we have to. Clearly __we__ can do something about this. Even if that is refusing to build such things, let alone build defenses. Apathy is no different than supporting these authoritarian takeover, because that's what it is. Authoritarian creep.
You're right that tech isn't the solution, but it also is. A hammer is part of the toolset to solving homelessness. It can also be used to create the homeless. We can build homes or tear them down. Hell, we can even smack someone on the side of the head with one.
Tech is too abstracted, and we must concentrate on the application. There is time for abstraction and time for specification. Tech is used to extract information as well as tech is used to protect information. These are actions, not objects or attributes.
And yes, it isn't the only tool in the toolbox. But it is a tool everyone here shares in common. It is a tool that many here are using to create this problem. One that many are probably not even aware that they are contributing to. But due to the commonality of our community and the commonality in its usage to create or exacerbate the problem, it is worth mentioning and considering.
Don't pass the buck. There are no singular causes nor solutions. So if we dismiss something because it is incomplete, we will never create any solution.
We've literally created this problem by making industrial-scale stalking profitable and socially-acceptable. We've created an entire self-sustaining industry that spies on everyone, is not accountable and that the government can just ask for data when needed.
Yes, but I don't think most people realized that they were doing it. Now we have a better idea. We can turn things around. You can just decide to not cut corners to do things fast and do things right. We talk left and right about enshitification, but let's be honest, it usually doesn't take significantly longer to do things the right way. In fact, I'd argue that generally you'll get things done quicker, but maybe not in the 2 week sprint timeframe.
Solving these issues won't make you much money, and anyone that gets close will invite more heat than the center of the sun. Better to divest. Keep an email and phone for essential services like banking but avoid all other activity.
Do you build tech for the money? It is not why I do it. Yes, I need to earn a living. But it is exactly that. What is necessary for living. What is the point of earning money if it is not to better our lives? Why is money the only way we can improve our lives?
> We're on a tech forum known to have some of the best and brightest and visited by tech giants. If anyone can solve this problem, it is us. If we are the ones giving up, then who is there to make things right?
You think the world’s geniuses are hanging out here? The world’s brightest are here and you’re going to inspire them to solve what you frame should be a very high priority? There are much bigger problems to solve.
I really think your vanity is warping your perspective.
The privacy of the world's populace sounds like a pretty big problem to me considering the damage that can be caused by that information getting into the wrong hands.
> You think the world’s geniuses are hanging out here?
Maybe. But they at least frequent here.
> I really think your vanity is warping your perspective.
I think you undervalue yourself. I don't see myself as a big cog, but neither am I disillusioned to believe that just because I'm a cog in a much larger and more complex machine means that I have little to no importance. Lesser, but non-zero. Were I to have the vanity you suspect I have, I would not be calling for your support as I would use my ego to solve it alone. But I am not. I can't do this alone. Nor am I drumming up people to collect wood and assign tasks, but I am trying to help those find a longing for the endless immensity of the sea. I am trying to help us realize we aren't inconsequential and that together, we have meaningful power. The big cog may be shiny and may have a lot more power, but it is still supported by a thousand smaller ones.
I have no illusion that people here work for Google, Meta, Apple, Amazon, Microsoft, and so on. Do you really think differently?
Any truly reliable privacy and anonymity tool that isn't created by the government will probably be made illegal by the government. Failing that, using it will make you a target of the government's security apparatus. If you create a cryptocurrency that can't be traced[0] or an anonymous marketplace where people can buy and sell anything they want[1], you're going to end up on the wrong end of US government trade sanctions or US drug laws. Running a Tor exit node gets your IP address blocked by much of the internet and can even get you a visit from the FBI[2]. Tor itself only exists because it was created by the US Navy as a tool for dissidents in dictatorships to be able to access the internet.
The only way to solve the problem would be to elect politicians who would either dismantle most of the surveillance system or address crime and terrorism so decisively that there was no longer any plausible threat to justify continuing to maintain a mass surveillance apparatus in which case it would (hopefully) eventually wither away as part of budget cuts once politicians forget why it was even "necessary" in the first place. There is no solution to political problems without obtaining and using political power to solve them.
The strategy of eliminating the system's justification isn't foolproof though because the bureaucracy that runs the military draft (Selective Service) somehow still exists even though the draft was ended around half a century ago and is almost certainly never coming back. Politicians only noticed it existed a few years ago long enough to debate whether to extend the wrong of registration for it to include women in addition to men. The eventual decision was to leave the status quo intact[3]. The sensible option of abolishing that relic of a past rights violation rather than continuing to waste money on maintaining the bureaucracy was not seriously considered. That means the direct route is almost certainly the better approach.
As I see it, our only choice is to make privacy and anonymity trivial. Not for techies, but for our tech illiterate grandparents. Push hard for tools like Signal where people can get encryption without having to think about encryption. People want privacy and security but they just don't know how or don't understand what leaks data. But there's the clear irony that the sector __we__ are critical to is the one who is creating this problem.
I'm not ready to swallow that pill. I'm unconvinced we have to. Clearly __we__ can do something about this. Even if that is refusing to build such things, let alone build defenses. Apathy is no different than supporting these authoritarian takeover, because that's what it is. Authoritarian creep.