On: Facing reality about the EU is a core requirement ...

[michaelt]

> As an European I fail to see how I could call myself patriot and at the same time distrust my own government - elected by me.

Can you see how an Italian might love Italy, but think that Silvio Berlusconi seems like a pretty suspicious chap?

[soco → michaelt]

The patriots mentioned in GP don't distrust Biden, they distrust the entire system and elections and representation, everything. Disliking Berlusconi motivated Italians to vote him out of office, not to burn down Palazzo Chigi. That's the difference I meant above.