On: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recal...

[mikojan]

> Under such circumstances, what should Israel do? Pack up their bags and leave?

That is exactly what they should do: End the occupation.

[devenvdev → mikojan]

How? There are generations born in Israel, people who have nothing to do with occupation, they were born into this situation same like Palestinians. Why would they leave?

My father is Belorussian jew, mother Dagestanian Ukrainian, I was born in Russia. I'm Israely. Where exactly do you want me to pack up my bags and leave? Because I WILL fight you if you'll try to deport me to Russia...

I consider calls "to end the occupation" a sign of lack of understanding of the other side, we have nowhere to go.

[mikojan → devenvdev]

Israel controls Gaza's borders. Israel controls the sea. Israel controls Gaza's airspace. Israel controls the products entering and exiting Gaza. Israel controls even more areas than this. The occupation is ongoing. And it needs to end.

I do not care if you continue your live in Russia or Israel...

[devenvdev → mikojan]

You haven't answered "How?".

[wahnfrieden → devenvdev]

By not leaving, but ending the subjugation as occupiers

[wahnfrieden → devenvdev]

they would stay there as they please as long as they aren't subjugating palestine as occupiers.

[devenvdev → wahnfrieden]

Uhm, have you asked "them"?

I yet to see "let's end the occupation" call that resulted in a less naive conversation.

What you propose is not a plan or a decent answer to "how to end occupation".

[wahnfrieden → devenvdev]

when apartheid south africa ended, the people remained. populations were not mass deported as you're suggesting must happen to end occupation - simply ahistorical. why is that more farfetched to you than mass deportations (to, as you say, where?)

btw, i used "they" to refer to the same "they" that you wrote. don't insinuate anything with scare quotes.

[devenvdev → wahnfrieden]

> what should Israel do? Pack up their bags and leave? > That is exactly what they should do: End the occupation.

If you'll ask Palestinians ending occupation means exactly that, Jews leaving, thus the famous slogan, Hamas charter, etc.

I think you are being deliberately obtuse at this point, so this conversation is over on my part.

[wahnfrieden → devenvdev]

The Hamas charter advocates for the 1967 borders as a "formula for national consensus". Goodbye!

[prmph → mikojan]

By "Pack up their bags and leave" I meant, do Israelis have to vacate their country altogether as a condition of peace?

I understand Israel left Gaza in 2005, so I'm not sure what occupation is being referred to here. If you mean the blockade, don't you think Hamas laying down arms and renouncing violence would be a good first step towards convincing the Israelis to lift the blockade?

[mikojan → prmph]

> I understand Israel left Gaza in 2005, so I'm not sure what occupation is being referred to here.

Israel controls Gaza's borders. Israel controls the sea. Israel controls Gaza's airspace. Israel controls the products entering and exiting Gaza. Israel controls even more areas than this. The occupation is ongoing.

> [Don't] you think Hamas laying down arms and renouncing violence would be a good first step towards convincing the Israelis to lift the blockade?

People living under occupation have a right to armed resistance under international law. Israel has no right to continue its occupation.