I haven't tried Remix but I can relate to Next.js being too much magic. I've had errors in `getServerSideProps` that happen on the server and then again in the client, causing a client side error instead of simply rendering the 500 page. I've accidentally bundled server code in the client because there's no clear separation. The automagical client side navigation with <Link> has caused scroll position to be forgotten when navigating back.
I recently tried Deno Fresh and it has made many different choices that I resonate with:
- "When you create a route, all of the components used are rendered on the server. No javascript is sent to the client, unless you specifically include something from the /islands/ folder."
- "For stronger resiliency and user experience, Fresh relies on native browser support for form submissions with the HTML <form> element."
For example a route that renders a form and accepts a `POST` with that form is trivial, which amazingly can not be said for many server side React frameworks.
Deno Fresh pushing "islands" is a huge negative... but that's to be expected when Vercel's VC enforcers are behind it.
99% of the React ecosystem does not function without reactivity enabled: it's literally in the name.
As a result most applications written in React depend heavily on interactivity. The only category that is an exception is ecommerce where you're normally pulling from a CMS... and Vercel needed to fight Shopify for that space so they went and "helped" the React team turn the framework into something it's not with RSC.
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Also most of your complaints aren't at all addressed by Deno? It uses an amount of magic closer to current Next.js than pages-era. It actually removes some conventions for separation that Next.js has (all routes potentially being api routes for example). And as far as I can tell both libraries expect you to explicitly handle errors during data fetching (and your users would probably appreciate that too)
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One of these days I might get annoyed enough to fork Next.js 1.0, sprinkle in a folder router for express and call it a day on a framework that doesn't fight React and just stays out of my way.
I recently tried Deno Fresh and it has made many different choices that I resonate with:
- "When you create a route, all of the components used are rendered on the server. No javascript is sent to the client, unless you specifically include something from the /islands/ folder."
- "For stronger resiliency and user experience, Fresh relies on native browser support for form submissions with the HTML <form> element."
For example a route that renders a form and accepts a `POST` with that form is trivial, which amazingly can not be said for many server side React frameworks.