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Best Resume Ever: How to Woo a Startup (ridejoy.com)
228 points by jasonshen on Feb 9, 2012 | hide | past | favorite | 69 comments



Killjoy, I know, but you'd probably want to have permission from Spoon (or, more likely, Merge Records) before repurposing their most popular track commercially.

Similarly, annoying as it probably sounds, virtually anything a startup would ever want to do with a piece of music anyone has heard of before† is probably not kosher. On the flip side, there's thousands of amazingly talented musicians willing to record tracks for tiny amounts of money, so maybe investigate that instead of just grabbing random tracks from iTunes.

The obvious and (please presume) prolific apologies apply if rights to You Got Yr Cherry Bomb were secured for this. Totally possible.

Including but not limited to putting it center stage on a cheerful and uplifting branded company blog post about resumes.


Good point! My understanding, from speaking with the SlideRocket team, is that it's kosher to use another artist's song as your presentation soundtrack as long as you attribute the song in your presentation somewhere. But if I were doing a similar project in the future, I'd absolutely love to work with a musician to record something - that's a terrific suggestion.

EDIT: Just spoke directly with a representative at SlideRocket, Sogol Motiey, who says, "Nope! No copyright issues."


Pretty sure that's totally not true, but, boy would I ever like to be proven wrong about this. As I understand it, and excuse the language, but attribution has fuck-all to do with the rights to music.

There's a whole market for "royalty-free music" (all of which costs money, but at least doesn't cost money per view) that exists entirely --- again, as I understand it --- because you can't just use random copyrighted songs in presentations, on websites, &c.

Sliderocket even links to some of these sites on an article about adding audio to presentations:

http://www.sliderocket.com/blog/2010/07/incredible-presentat...

Note conspicuous lack of "and if you like Apples In Stereo, just drag an MP3 into this window and make sure to say thank you in your presentation". :)

In any case, so I don't sound too much like a message-board-crazy, let me at least commend you on your taste in music. At least it wasn't Ke$ha.


This might be a good place to get started: http://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/Copyright

Here's some more on "Fair Use": http://www.benedict.com/Info/FairUse/FairUse.aspx


A very good source on fair use:

http://fairuse.stanford.edu/Copyright_and_Fair_Use_Overview/...

Note the "four factors" in fair use:

* The extent to which the use transforms the original work

* The nature of the work being used

* The amount and substantiality of the use

* The effect of the use on the market

I'm pretty sure soundtracking your resume with almost the entirety of a signed band's most popular track flunks all these tests --- charming though that resume is.

I'm actually not at all concerned about musical resumes --- seriously, does Britt Daniel care about resumes? Of course he doesn't --- so much as the mentality at startups that this stuff is always going to be kosher. Not so. HN just got finished shellacking a different YC company over this exact issue.

Be careful about music, is all I'm really saying.


You're correct that this would fail a fair-use test. Once it went up on a blog it's akin to a public performance, and use of the master recording should be licensed.

It is improbable that someone is going to issue a DMCA letter because of this, but it does (to your point) outline a couple of problems in S.V., one of which is the misconception that "It's not stealing if you attribute the artist" is widespread. And incorrect, at least for anything (c)All Rights Reserved.

If in doubt, it's a good idea for startups to consult their attorney (and not the PM, or lead engineer, or friend-in-a-band) when in doubt when using music, art, or what-have-you in public fora.


Everything is "(c) All Rights Reserved" unless it specifically says otherwise, just to clarify a superficial point.

So am I crazy or did whoever this person talk to at Sliderocket give her ludicrously bad advice?


tonecluser responded to the wrong person, but you're both right - that was very bad advice. There are definite copyright problems here.

Even if they could win this in court (which they probably couldn't), it's certainly not so cut and dry that anyone would just say 'nope, no problems, carry on' and be done with it.


You're not crazy; it was ludicrously bad (or at least ill-informed) advice. And you are correct - unless published under a specific license, music "fixed" into some format is (c)All Rights Reserved.


Isn't that weird? Don't you guys have performance rights separate from copy rights?

I mean... yeah, using the music means that a payment should be made, but why is it copyright rather than performance rights?

This is just a general question. I used to work in the industry and only reading this do I see how weird it is.

We had the MCPS and PRS. One does physical copies of recordings, and the other does performances of a recording.

Performing rights are what should be applied here, no copy is being offered, it's simply a broadcast.

That being so... why would copyright apply? And if that is the case, then surely all of the fair use doesn't apply because that's related to fair use of copyrights, not performance rights.

Example: If I made a video and had the Beatles on as a sound track. Then I need to make sure I have performance rights (usually by a blanket fee), and don't need to consider copyright at all.

PRS music fees are covered here: http://www.prsformusic.com/users/broadcastandonline/onlinemo...

Obviously this all has a UK slant, it's what I know... just curious as to why a similar thing doesn't apply here and it's considered copyright (MCPS equivalent) when no copy is being made.


"is that it's kosher to use another artist's song as your presentation soundtrack as long as you attribute the song in your presentation somewhere."

No, it's not kosher at all.

Regardless of your opinions on copyright, etc - this is simply not correct as it stands.


So they pay streaming license fees to ASCAP / BMI on behalf of their users?

Public attribution does nothing to make it kosher, only reporting it so the royalties get doled out to the appropriate artists does that.


It is possible that BMI will send a bill, eventually, if they notice. Note that this is separate from paying for a license to use the master (the recording).


You're right, since this isn't just streaming but also use in a larger work — you can't just use someone's song in what's essentially an advertisement without their permission

Kickstarter must have to deal with this shit all the time in the project videos


It apparently happens enough that they have to mention it:

MAKING IT YOURS

And remember, don’t use music, images, video, or other content that you don’t have the rights to. Using copyrighted material is almost always illegal and can lead to expensive lawsuits down the road. The easiest way to avoid copyright troubles? Either create all the content yourself or use content that is free for public use. For example, you may be able to use some Creative Commons-licensed music — per the terms of their licenses — that's available on SoundCloud. Other resources you can explore: Vimeo Music Store, Free Music Archive, and ccMixter.


The underdog holds that distinction I think. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q1hZVDLkJDc

Spoon is the only existing band I don't hate.


Not trying to be a buzz-kill. It's a neat idea, sure...

1. It's too slow. I want to know about you, now. I'm a fast reader and want to get on with reading at my own pace, not the pace you've decided to have fancy transitions slide in.

2. I don't have a ton of time to sit through this.

3. There is no detail. You show logos of some impressive places you've (presumably) worked... but... what did you do there? What did you learn? How will that experience make you a good fit at company x?


I agree that if this was the only thing Margot sent, it would not be as compelling. But she also sent a resume and an exceptionally well-written cover letter with a lot of great ideas about how she'd engage the Ridejoy community (we ask for 5 ideas from all job applicants).

I think we would have at least phone screened her without this video slideshow, but it took us from "interested" to "wow, this girl looks super legit and really wants this job". If you're a job applicant, that might be worth a lot.


I now see what I was competing with. Great choice!


> 2. I don't have a ton of time to sit through this.

What startup do you work for and how many resumes do you get? If someone made the effort to submit this to mine, I would "sit through" it.


I agree. Although the format has its drawbacks, the effort will get attention if the startup's culture is right. If it isn't, somebody like Margot probably would not be interested in working there anyways.


> 1. It's too slow. I want to know about you, now. I'm a fast reader and want to get on with reading at my own pace, not the pace you've decided to have fancy transitions slide in.

Fair point. Had this been poorly done, I would've hated that I couldn't flip through it quickly, but since it's well done I don't mind it so much.

> 2. I don't have a ton of time to sit through this.

This is essentially the same point was 1.

> 3. There is no detail. You show logos of some impressive places you've (presumably) worked... but... what did you do there? What did you learn? How will that experience make you a good fit at company x?

She also included her resume, presumably with that level of detail.


She submitted a resume as well.


Not sure if this is too adorable (adorkable?) for Hacker News, but it's certainly relevant!

It's a bit irrational to put this much effort into a job app-- but it's also an incredibly strong positive signal.

For early-stage startups, passion for the space, the people, makes a huge difference. You don't just want the right skills and talent (which Margot also had in abundance), you want people who care.

(And of course, we're hiring a lead designer and engineer: http://www.ridejoy.com/jobs/. Don't worry, preparing a slideshow is not actually necessary.)


It's a bit irrational to put this much effort into a job app

It's perfectly rational if you're being savvy about how you approach your job search. If you're playing a numbers game and sending out 200 resumes a day to jobs you're poorly qualified to work at, this is very irrational, since it will not meaningfully increase your hit rate but will severely decrease the amount of resume spam you're capable of. Don't do that.

If, on the other hand, you've done your research and know that there are three positions out there you'd be perfect for, spending two hours (or ten hours) on a sales presentation is a pretty good use of your time. The NPV of a job upgrade, particularly from unemployed or student to "first gainful employment in a meanginful role", is staggering. Heck, I'd do this just to close consulting sales if I thought it would meaningfully affect outcomes -- it's a LOT less work than often goes into getting five figure engagements on the calendar.

Now is it the best possible job search tactic ever? No. Major points for creativity, and "do the job before you have the job" is one of the most effective things you can do in sales, but you'd probably do even better to get a warm intro to the hiring manager and convince them in person that you're the perfect candidate for the position. The resume is optional at that point, but if you've already met them, you're essentially guaranteed that they'll actually review it. (The likelihood of falling out of the funnel before your content is even seen is a major reason why I would suggest not just e.g. throwing one of these into someone's inbox and praying.)


I disagree on the "irrational" part: I think it raises your chance of getting an interview by a huge amount, and getting that interview sooner rather than later.

Also, consider: The whole effort doesn't need to be unique. Yes it would need to be customized for each employer, but once you've done the work, you can potentially use it again.

Unless it gets featured on Hacker News, of course. At that point you'd pretty much need to start over for your next job application. But hopefully at that point it's earned you a job. :)


Doesn't the fact that she got the job prove your claim of it being "a bit irrational" wrong? Not only did she get the job, she was (apparently) the top candidate as soon as your team watched it.

Plus, as an added bonus, it got her and her new company on the front page of HN. Have any of your other new hires done that?


I think the best way to get a job is to take your top choice and be irrationally invested in working there. When they are sifting through resumes and you come with this, you are in!


I'm a big proponent of resumes that show personality and break the mold. Do a search for examples of designer resumes and you'll see how much of a person can be expressed through just the design choices, while still expressing all of the relevant content that you expect.

I've heard from resume screeners that a lot of them are told to throw out anything that doesn't match one of the standard formats, or that has color. But do you want to work for a company that imposes such arbitrary, or at the very least stale, rules from the get-go? I think the corporations (generally larger ones) that have these kinds of restrictions could be missing out on the most creative and self-driven employees.


Thinking about it, I am absolutely certain that I'm not interested in working for a company that would throw out resumes with color.

In fact, I'm going to have to add color to my resume now just so that I don't accidentally get an offer from a company like that. ;)


Too long, didn't watch.

Seriously though, she could learn a thing or two about brevity and efficiently communicating a message. I lost interest quickly.


Your patience apparently didn't carry you to the part of the post where she got the job because of this presentation.


And reading a few page resume is quicker? I don't think you have a strong grasp as to what the presentation was aiming to accomplish or how the presentation stood out from the rest.


Well, it's boring but also it's good resume : she shows her interest and passion.

If someone send me such a resume for " engineering position ", i would probably stop watching after 10 seconds.


Seriously, perhaps you could learn an thing or two about focus. And paying attention.


Unrelated but something that irritates me with company blogs is no easy link to view to product/go to homepage. I keep clicking logos on the page trying to reach their homepage and see what their company is about, but it's all in vain, I get frustrated and leave. I know I could manually type it in but I'm too stubborn.


I've noticed this more and more too. Blogs often have the same design/layout as the actual site, but when you click on the company logo in the top left, it links to the blog home page, not the company site home page.

Hate that!


Great feedback! We just edited the blog layout to make our logo go to ridejoy.com!


Hey TomGullen, sorry you had that issue! We have a blue bar that says "Find friendly people to share rides with at Ridejoy.com! ►" and another link on the sidebar in the about section. Let me know if you have ideas for how to make the link more clear!

EDIT: We just edited the blog layout to make our logo go to ridejoy.com!


Lots better!


Wow now that's a great use of an awesome piece of software. I wasn't expecting that.

Putting myself in the shoes of an employer, this would be an instant win. It shows she took the time to put something together that's more than just a resume. However, I don't know how well this will fly with a large multi-national company (think IBM, Alcatel, etc). That's why I like startups, they're usually filled with happy people and good ideas.


This is awesome. I love her initiative and even more I love how the guys at ridejoy responded in kind. Really shows they love what they do and are having a great time.


Aw, thanks so much! I was absolutely blown away by how Ridejoy reciprocated; I honestly wasn't expecting that at all. (I may even have teared up slightly, but I'll never tell!) They're an incredible team and I am so lucky to be working here.


Congrats, Margot. Have a great time working with Jason & Crew!


Thanks, Zachary! Looking forward to an awesome, if crazy ride with an exceptional bunch. :)


In my experience you do a good job :)


Wow, thanks so much! High praise indeed.


Perhaps this is a dumb question, but what does it mean to "Mainline RSS Feeds"? (slide 12 from the link)


To consume them intravenously, as one would cocaine or heroin.


I did that once, but a typographical error landed me in the hospital for months.


Oh my. And here I imagined some nifty webapp for easier rss reading. I suppose that would work as well.


Looking at all this incredible talent makes my mind boggle with amazement. It's more than just the skill, it's being able to reach out to people in innovative ways that make the best impression. Pumping up a resume seems to be less and less relevant than showing what kind of person you are.


yeah, I'm too old for this.


That's a lot of work to go through just for an application... How to "woo" a startup? What was that about a shortage of tech talent?


I'm curious how many other startups she sent basically the same template to...


This is one of the few times I've disagreed with hacker news. Sorry. Not a fan. :(


This is a sort of weird criterion, but I'm partial to the CVs done in LaTeX...


That not weird once you pick it apart. Chances are that you're not actually partial to LaTeX CVs, you're partial to someone who shares your willingness to invest the effort in learning the right tool for the job (and, boy, is LaTeX ever the right tool for many jobs?), rather than shying away at the first sign of difficulty.


What happens when this "best resume" becomes "best practice" and people really take it seriously that this is "How to woo a startup"?

Do companies really want to sift through video slideshows for, say, engineering jobs?


As a way to separate oneself from other candidates, this cannot be beat. Amazing job, Margot, and RJ for the great reply.

I am so sick of that song.


It's not the best resume ever but a terrific example of using some creativity to make a connection. I'm surprised more people didn't take that away from this slide show. It's about hustle, creativity, putting yourself out there. The essence of this is doing something to set yourself apart from the 10 other people looking for the same job.


I was more impressed by the content than the presentation.

I guess that's why I and my local marketing organisation don't always see eye-to-eye.


This was absolutely brilliant. Great work @margotleong!! ... and great work RideJoy too!


Great resume, seriously.

Pictures are worth 1000 words, as they say


My firewall blocked your slides because all the requests were sent with null content-type headers.



We've found that candidates who submit a dynamic resume are good because

1) it shows personality

2) it shows initiative

and 3) a willing to think outside the box, all of which we value.

Obviously the content of the resume has to be great and everything else has to line up too, but this gets you a lot of facetime that not everyone gets. We were looking for a UI guy and got a ton of interest from folks (thanks HN!), but one applicant stood out to us because he went through the effort of making a site focused on getting the job with us (http://jaredhardy.com/fee-fighter/). We hired him.


Is she the author of all the power point emails my mom forwards me?


Didn't like the resume (too slow). Very boring, imo.

Changed my mind after seeing her photo.




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