I said suggests, not proves. It can't prove anything, it's just one data point. It does seem very unlikely for a dozen people to score so well academically if genetics wasn't a factor at all, or? Why didn't other, richer people score higher than any of them? And why did they marry other intelligent people?
> privileged upbringing and generational welth reproducing themselves
I come from an ex Soviet satellite state, I don't think your assumptions of what my parents/grandparents' life was like is accurate. I had a more privileged upbringing, but that doesn't explain 2 generations away.
> (same as my parents and theirs, which really suggests a genetic component)
I am not at all put off by genetic explanations (go genes!), but it does equally suggest environment and upbringing as a common element, it's a series of poster children for it.
I concede you have a point there. My opinions are colored by my experiences.
As a personal story that I will share since it also has value as an experiment: I did not see my father between the ages of 0-3 and 7-19. That means he was not there for a large part of my developmental phase, in which I formed a lot of my viewpoints on the world (at the time, obviously).
What astounded me was that when I met him, he shared a lot of those viewpoints. A lot of my behaviour that I thought was specific to me, was not. Even small things like preference for walking etc. I will not list everything obviously but it really ingrained in me that a lot of what I considered "my identity" was not chosen in any way by me. We grew up in rather different environments/countries too.
I think most humans would rather not face the fact that their identity is scarcely chosen. But learning to accept that means you can experience a lot more, since your ego doesn't mind losing parts that aren't "really part of it" anyway. Or at least it's less scary.
I drive a pickup truck. Like my dad, grandpa and uncles. Do you think there might be a genetic compent to my choice of vehicle? Its strongly suggested as such, according to you.
I have blue eyes, as does my mother and my two children. Do you think it is due to our similar upbringing and socioeconomic status?
Maybe genetics plays a much larger role in intelligence than we currently think, it's just so complicated that (unlike eye color) we can't identify those genes yet.
Almost all flamingos are pink. Do you think this is "genetic" the same way human eye colors are "genetic"?
(It isn't.)
> Maybe genetics plays a much larger role in intelligence than we currently think, it's just so complicated that (unlike eye color) we can't identify those genes yet.
People telling you "genetics causes x" are committing abuses of notation if they don't include the counterfactual i.e. they are lying to you.
Everything about you is 100% caused by genetics - because otherwise you'd be a gorilla.
Everything about you is also 100% caused by the environment - because if a rock fell on your head you wouldn't have any "intelligence" after that.
Didn't they find some very crazy similarities in seemingly arbitrary lifestyle choices with identical twins that were separated at birth? I would rate the choice of vehicle the same way, in other words, possibly genetic.
The original topic under discussion is the impotence of being clever. It seems to me your cleverness (and that of others replying to the original comment) is demonstrating that.
> privileged upbringing and generational welth reproducing themselves
I come from an ex Soviet satellite state, I don't think your assumptions of what my parents/grandparents' life was like is accurate. I had a more privileged upbringing, but that doesn't explain 2 generations away.