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"There's a popular and cynical meme" is another way of phrasing, "There are people who evaluate these people's contributions differently than I do"

> It's laughably false and easily disproved.

Then disprove it, instead of relying on an ad hominem assumption of what's going on inside someone else's brain. As it stands all you've done is claim that a criticism exists and that the people who state that criticism have moral failings, which does not make them wrong.




> "There are people who evaluate these people's contributions differently than I do"

That would presume we're talking about people with approximately equivalent knowledge that simply come to different, but reasonable, conclusions.

But this is not the case. What I see in this meme is people betraying their ignorance and motivated reasoning at every turn. There's nothing knowledgeable or reasonable about their assertions. It's always highly vitriolic and dismissive toxicity. It's not that they're simply mistaken about certain facts, and can be corrected, it's that they're transparently ignorant and/or acting in bad faith.

For example, it's extremely uncommon, maybe even unheard of, for someone with a deep knowledge of technology history to agree with these kinds of dismissals of Steve Jobs or Elon Musk. I've never seen someone able to discuss the topic at a high level that won't readily acknowledge their contributions, even if they can be very critical of them in certain ways. As one example among many: historian and professor Walter Isaacson wrote well respected books about Benjamin Franklin, Albert Einstein, and Steve Jobs. He is currently writing one about Elon Musk.


So you don't have proof, just more ad hominem and appeals to authority.


I did reply in a sibling thread to a similar comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31345710

But c'mon. You're really just playing dumb. We all know what SpaceX/Tesla and Apple have done, and (I think) we all know the role Musk and Jobs played in their success. And the reason we all know these things is precisely because of how important what they've done is. It's self-evident.

So, it seems pretty reasonable to assume that you're not acting in good faith. And that's why I answered indirectly.

But, okay, what "proof" would you find convincing?




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