Hacker News new | past | comments | ask | show | jobs | submit login

I have a different problem with LCDs. I still think they're too bright. With a CRT you could set everything to white on black and you had almost no light coming out of the screen. Also brightness meant brightness and you could turn it way down for when working in dim light or darkness.

Of course i'm talking about text work here.

Maybe when OLED monitors become affordable we'll go back to monitors that aren't basically a lamp shining into your eyes all day. At least the oled on my phone looks like it doesn't put out light where it shouldn't.

For gaming, i'm not latency sensitive, but then i don't play twitch shooters any more. I'm more the kind that buys mid-low range video cards and turns on the fps limiter where it's available.




I’d recommend adding bias lighting to your monitor. It won’t make the monitor less bright, but it’ll light up the wall behind your monitor so there’s less of a contrast between the wall and your monitor, which reduces eye strain.


I tried that but looked like too much effort. Instead, I never turn off the room lights any more when using monitors. Seems good enough since oled is coming.


I use a normal desk lamp and point it at the wall behind my monitors. Super easy, cheap, and effective.

https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B083DG5CK1/



Same!

I do it for both the monitor and the TV, with two cheap "Ingared" lamps from IKEA; can recommend.


LED strips stuck to the monitor itself, pointed at the wall. Powered from a USB port on the monitor if it has one.


This is what I do. Cost what $10 and took about 5 minutes. Well worth it.


In the age of video conferences, this will also improve your appearance a lot. Soft, indirect light coming from behind the camera… you just build your own softbox.


I've been working from home for at least 15 out of the last 20 years. Never did a single video conference.


I actually have panel lights for this precise purpose that I turn on during meetings.


Yeah I have no idea why the lowest levels on monitors are so bright. Are there models that can go really low without the PWM flicker effect kicking in (that's another problem I have with monitors, I can notice the damn cheap PWM backlight)?

Laptop (and phone) displays don't seem to have this problem, the brightness goes really low...


I’ve always wished the Macbook’s lowest brightness setting was subdivided two or more times. It’s still too bright when I feel like reading in my dark room perhaps on the way to sleep. I have to use an app called Shady to cover the screen in a dimming overlay.


Have you tried using option-shift-[f1] to subdivide? or the brightness slider in the settings.


Interestingly, on my early 2015 13" MacBook Pro, the very lowest brightness setting seems to have no change in brightness on those last three subdivisions. Once I get down to one full "block" of brightness, option-shift-F1 moves the slider down in quarter-block increments but the screen gets no (perceptibly) dimmer until it shuts off entirely. All the other brightness settings have perceptible changes in brightness at every subdivision level.


Oh my god, thank you!

How does one find these "hidden" features?


Wow, I had no idea that was available.

Unfortunately it doesn't reduce the dimmest level on my MBP. The bottom 4 subdivisions look identical. Like level 0.25, 0.50, 0.75 and 1.00 are all the same brightness, only 1.25+ starts to get brighter.

The lowest level is still too bright at night. That's unfortunate.

However it does reduce the dimmest level of the keyboard illumination!

That's great. I always found the keyboard too bright at its lowest level at night, but some illumination at night would be helpful for obvious reasons. Now I can enjoy 3 subdivisions lower - thank you :-)


After lowering brightness to 0 the brightness can be lowered by lowering the contrast ratio. It’s obviously not perfect but does work.


Most better monitors and everything targeted at office use does not use PWM for backlight brightness control.

LCDs have poor blacks because they're a filter put in front of a lamp, so to render black, they have to try and block as much light as possible, but our visual perception is logarithmic and adaptive, making them look quite bad. The workaround is to add bias light behind the monitor; it quite literally provides a bias for the eye to keep it inside a certain adaption range, which reduces the perceived poorness of dark tones. (It also is more ergonomic.).


The vast majority of modern high-quality monitors have flicker-free backlights without PWM dimming.

https://www.rtings.com/monitor/tests/motion/image-flicker


Yes, there are a bunch of monitors now that do not use PWM for brightness control. And since PWM became known as a problem PWM rate is tested in professional benchmarks. So you definitely can get monitors that do not have that flicker, where the minimal brightness will also not be too high.


I am still waiting for a decent size e-ink screen (22"+) without backlight which should be enough for low-FPS stuff like backend coding, slack, terminal and text content web pages. Existing solutions are still too small - Dasung and Onyx Boox are 13.3" with HDMI.


i have never heard of an e-ink screen with fast enough refresh to be viable for coding


I think both of these are usable https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NozoRkE0DTo they use various optimizations to avoid full panel refresh. Here is coding example with Dasung although it is hard to judge scrolling quality https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OO0Qzuw18q8


How about a display that had a large e-ink screen plus a small LCD of maybe 2-4 lines at the bottom?

Go old school for editing. Use something like TECO or ed or Rob Pike, David Tilbrook, Hugh Redelmeier and Tom Duff's Unix version of QED [1].

The small LCD is for seeing the command you are currently typing and a little command history.

With those editors you entered editing commands but did not see the results until you asked for them. You'd tell the editor to show you the current line plus say 10 lines before and after. Then you'd give it commands to edit the current line, such as telling it to change the text "float" to "double", or telling it to insert a new line before the current line, and so on. When you had done enough changes that you needed to refresh your notion of the current state of the file, you'd ask it to show you again.

Even the older generation, slower e-ink screens would be fast enough for that kind of work.

Maybe instead of putting the small LCD display at the bottom of the e-ink screen, make it a separate unit that can attach to the e-ink screen or attach to the top of your keyboard or stand alone somewhere if you prefer.

[1] https://github.com/phonologus/QED


what is your minimum refresh rate needed for coding?


Scrolling would be painful on e-ink


Also programmers tend to type pretty fast after getting some experience. It's disconcerting enough when code completion slows down the editor, not sure i could stand a screen that can only refresh every full line.


This is why vim has multi-character movements.

The problem here doesn't seem that different from coding over a slow network, something that's been possible for quite a while.


Coding over a slow network is the sole reason I know to use vi :)

But i'd rather not do it daily.


When I'm coding I'd usually do pgup/pgdn, don't think this would be a huge issue.


Syntax highlighting is too important to me to use this.


Decent color e-ink tech is finally here:

https://gizmodo.com/the-first-color-e-ink-devices-are-finall...

It's just a matter of time before a major brand (Amazon, Microsoft, etc.) decides to take a chance and use it to make a big multipurpose tablet.


It is only color coding one may miss, although it is going to change with faster color eink panels. There is a still a lot of other ways to mark syntax: font, borders, underlines, cursive, grascale tones, background inversion.


I suspect that people leaving LCDs at their eye-burning default brightness (looks great in a store demo competing against the lighting and other monitors, but not at all for long-term work) is at least part of the reason for all the excessively low-contrast websites.


If you calibrate your LCD monitor you'll also end up with eye burning brightness as far as i know :)


It's mildly annoying but easily fixed with a touch of ambient lighting or a software tool looks f.lux.

Brightness isn't nearly as bad for eye strain has contrast between the screen and ambient light.


Better even than f.lux was Nocturne (https://github.com/strider72/blacktree-nocturne), though it hasn’t worked in years. (Maybe a decade? I can’t even find screenshots.)

Nocturne would let you invert your entire screen, then shift it to monochrome (ideally red). Obviously useless for gaming or color work, but I’ve not run across anything since that’s so great for late night text work across the whole OS.


I've never seen Nocturne but on Windows 10 inverted colors+night shift works well (IIRC has an option for grayscale, too). On Linux you can achieve the same effect with xca+redshift (not sure about grayscale).


I have switched all programs to darkmode where possible. If not possible I don't use it.

f.lux can do invert and redshift though: shift+alt+end


I have OLED screens all over my house - I can never tell if the monitors are on or off unless the screensaver kicks in. 0 regrets spending that money.


By "monitors" you mean TVs? Or did you buy some of the $3-4k monitors that seem to be available?

At a quick google there's nothing under 3k and they're either 21" (too small) or 55" (fine for console gaming but not for programming if you ask me).


According to this youtube video [0], LG's OLED TVs work well as a monitors, at least the 48 inch one. Can't vouch for the quality of that channel though, and it is a sponsored video.

Regarding size for programming, I use a 40 inch monitor and wouldn't mind additional width.

[0] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzp3fF6AL88


Funny, most programmers complain they don't have enough height. Me included.

Say, are there any 16:10 oleds? :)

Edit: Hmm, one 40" 4k instead of 2x24" 1920x1200. Maybe.

Not that LG has any 40" oleds, the smallest i see (locally) is 55".


I would usually agree with them - but I finally feel like I have just about enough height with my 40 incher. Not that having more would be harmful, but I'm worried that the webcam on top would start to look weird if it was higher.

Here is the 48 inch oled from LG: https://www.lg.com/us/tvs/lg-oled48cxpub-oled-4k-tv


VA panels have by far the blackest blacks of any LCD technology. Viewing angles and uniformity aren't as good as IPS, but they're the best option if you care about contrast.

https://www.rtings.com/monitor/tests/picture-quality/contras...


I think we need monitors with more dynamic range.


No thanks, because they add more light at the top not complete darkness at the bottom. The lantern shining in your eyes just gets brighter.

Incidentally this is how LCDs became so bright. So they can claim better contrast.


An OLED HDR1000 10-bit display can go from 0 to 1000 peak nit brightness with 10 bits per channel of color differences. Is that not good enough for you? It’s better than we’ve had for a long time with our 5 or 8 bit monitors that peak at like 250 nit.




Guidelines | FAQ | Lists | API | Security | Legal | Apply to YC | Contact

Search: