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I love cars, driving, and freedom in general. Just wanted to put that up front, because I'm going to suggest this isn't an issue with the manufacturer of motor vehicles, but with the massive government system(s) built around regulating them.

There is nothing stopping this terrific government thing everyone is raving about from passing some regulations that require people who operate motor vehicles on the roadways, actually be capable of operating motor vehicles on the roadways. Instead, we get short HS drivers education classes, that really only teach you what the 2 pedals in American cars does what, and perhaps a quick refresher on how "wheels" work.Then you get put on the highway, and taught to speed, but not too much, and generally ignore every other major rule there is.

I ride motorcycles, have taken several high performance driving classes, as well as drive in an amateur (wheel to wheel) auto racing series, and I still catch myself making mistakes on the roads. Its not an easy task, and the current system is woefully under performing when it comes to equipping people to handle it. This needs to be fixed by changing the culture around driving, if for no other reason than because sometimes machines fail, and the person behind the wheel needs to be responsible.




I don’t think you can simply educate people not to text and drive.

Governments are ramping up signs and laws against texting and driving and it doesn’t appear to be doing anything to stop the problem. People know it’s bad but they don’t care because they haven’t personally killed someone yet. Just like they’ve treated speeding laws for decades.

Surveillance apparatus that directly hits people in the pocketbook on a frequent basis with fines is the only way to solve this problem that keeps humans behind the wheel IMO (we had a thread recently about such cameras that are being tried in Australia). Or autonomous cars or a massive and incredibly expensive redesign of our cities and transportation network to get people out of cars.


I agree, and I'm not even American - it's criminal how little is required from people to let them drive on public roads, and their ability is pretty much never tested to any kind of standard again after passing their licence.


I think if you dig around you'll find that most crashes are due to poor judgement, not poor skills.


What's the difference?


Maybe not everyone uses it the same way but to me judgement in this context about values, risk appetite and empathy.

I just signed my youngest daughter up to a pretty extensive defensive driving course at a regional racing facility. When she's done, her skills will have improved but her judgement will be largely unchanged. If she was going to speed before and value her time over the safety of others around her, the same will likely be true afterwards. Fortunately (unlike her sister) she has taken after her mother and proven to be an extremely cautious driver. Her sister drives a smidge too fast for my liking, but we're working on it.


They seem to heavily overlap. I ride a motorcycle and move through traffic quickly. Is it skill? Or that I can judge the flow of traffic, that I do not ride next to any vehicle (or in their blind spot), that I slow down for intersections, especially blind ones or if I do not have a car with me to discourage a left on green.

I just don't see much difference. I consider good judgment to be inherently baked into driving.

Someone exercising poor judgment is not a skilled driver.


Good judgement can pretty easily keep you from situations where high skill is required.


As a driver of multiple decades, this checks out...except you need good judgement on all sides, not just yours.


Are there studies that show countries where you have to pay lots of money and have to pass rigorous exams have better pedestrian road safety? Maybe it’s so.


There are traffic fatality statistics by nearly all countries. Parts of Western Europe and Japan are much safer (like half the fatality rate) per capita but in my experience a lot of that is due to their infrastructure not allowing high speeds, though some of it is probably stricter licensing.


I was shocked by how low the speed limits were in the USA and Canada. They're noticably higher in Western Europe.


Most freeways and highways are 65mph/105kmh, some interstates are 75mph/120kph.

People tend to drive approx 10 over posted limit on highways/freeways/interstates when traffic allows unless there is speedtrap.


Wow, given how poorly people drive down here in FL I'm glad the speed limits are also significantly lower. Most highways are 40-50mph and the interstate is 50-70mph. People tend to drive around the speed limit or about 5-10mph over. Only exception (that I regularly see) is one part of I-4 people always seem to go 70mph when the posted limit is 50mph...


Last time I drove down to Miami on the 95 people were flying on that freeway going 90+ mph. I didn't see a single cop until I actually got to Miami and saw a few cops hauling screeching people out of the bars and throwing them into the street later that night.


You can see stretches of 80mph in some of the western states, and Texas has a few 85mph spots too.


The speed limits on European motorways are similar or higher than in the US.


Who do you think built the roads you drive on?


>I love cars, driving, and freedom in general.

Then be careful what you wish for lest you incite the DMV to morph into the FAA, FCC, or ATF.

I'm serious. You have not even begun to contemplate how miserable, soul killing, and inaccessible regulations can make something until you have really dug into something like that.

If you do love it, teach! Don't seek to lock a student out! Help them become better, faster, that they can do the same for someone they know!


Actually it's funny you should mention the FAA. I have much greater freedom at modifying my airplane than I do modifying my car.


Sure, if you have an E-AB airplane. If your airplane is certified you can’t do much as run a USB charger out to the panel without the FAA coming down on you like a ton of bricks.


That's true, but at least you have the choice of which route you want to go.

I guess even CA allows "home-made, specially constructed, or kit" vehicles. https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/dmv/detail/vr/spcnsreg


> how miserable, soul killing, and inaccessible regulations can make something

Given the amount of people being killed in car accidents daily, I'd say that's exactly what should happen to driving.


The only thing required to kill with a clean conscience is the green light. - from Sexual Taboos and the Law Today




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