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Launch HN: Hatchways (YC S19) – Internships Instead of Interviews
267 points by jaclynmling on July 31, 2019 | hide | past | favorite | 81 comments
Hi HN,

My name is Jaclyn Ling and I'm the co-founder/CEO of Hatchways (https://hatchways.io). We make it easier to get your first job.

More specifically, we help talented engineers who may not shine in traditional recruitment processes (resume + multiple interview processes) get opportunities to prove themselves on the job. We do this by using a practical skill-based assessment as a proxy for the resume, and then matching them to startups for paid internships, as a way to reduce full-time interview processes.

As a new grad without relevant work experience, or as a career shifter without a relevant degree, getting a first job is very painful. You spend months preparing for interviews that don’t reflect the job, you send hundreds of resumes out that go unanswered, and when you actually get interviews, getting through five rounds successfully is like a lottery.

I’ve been interested in this problem for a long time because of my own early struggles trying to get a job. I graduated from a foreign university (Canada), had a subpar GPA, and I don’t perform well in high-pressured style interviews. Somehow, I networked my way into getting interviews at all my “dream” companies. But I got rejected at every one of them and to this day, I’ve never gotten a job I’ve interviewed for. It deeply affected my confidence.

However, since then I was fortunate enough to start and exit a startup. We built a fashion app that made personal outfit recommendations based on your likes, which eventually evolved into a chatbot that provided recommendations to hundreds of thousands of teens. We got acquired, and when I was working for the company that acquired us, I finally realized that the interviews I'd failed at hadn’t reflected my ability to do well on the job.

Mainstream hiring processes are biased towards those who went to great schools, had high GPAs, are native-English speaking, have worked at brand name companies, are extroverts and great networkers, etc. But there are so many talented people who don't fit that profile. We're excited to work on ways of hiring that give them a better chance.

Our practical skill-based assessments simulate tasks they’d actually be doing on the job (e.g. project-based work). Engineers on our end review the job seeker’s code to pick up signals that are important for on-the-job such as: ability to follow a spec, code quality and how quickly the task is completed. An employer pays 90% of the cost only when a full-time hire is made, so ensuring that candidates have job-ready skills is crucial for us. We've found that it works to give people the opportunity to prove themselves on the job: 80% of our internships have resulted in full-time employment immediately after.

So far, we have helped talented engineers get software jobs who would have otherwise been overlooked: baristas and Uber drivers turned engineers, candidates with no local experience (from Turkey, India, Russia, Ethiopia, Brazil etc.), and those with non-CS degrees (linguistics, philosophy, economics, MBA’s, dentistry, mechanical engineering etc.)

I’d love to hear your thoughts and ideas about how we can improve this system and how we can best help talented people who shine once they get a chance to prove themselves. We would love to hear your personal experiences in this space too. Thank you!




I seriously hope you folks succeed. All the luck to you! Here's my non-traditional story:

I've worked on my own personal projects for 10 years, always looking for new challenges. I've dropped out of college after 2 years since it was crystal clear to me that I learned much more when working on my own stuff. I would learn new things in college, but at a much slower pace. I guess it was useful to learn calculus...

Anyway. Financially I never needed a fully paying job, so I could spend all my time doing my own research. From web security to docker to bsd to aws/gcp, I've managed to gather a lot of personal experience on many tools. Similarly, I went from PHP to Erlang to Haskell and back. For a brief period I even managed my own team!

But now, 10 years later, I just started looking for my first job and boy, do I realize my resume is empty! I have some code on github but none of my projects are famous or noteworthy. So far, most jobs I've applied for said I'm not qualified, and I don't blame them if all they looked at was my CV.

To solve this I'm working on (yet another) project, a distributed KV storage with built-in MQ capabilities, automatic clustering and transparent sharding, eventual consistency through the use of operation-based crdts, written in my favorite language for distributed systems (Elixir). Hopefully I can use it to get a job, but I think proving one's experience and knowledge should be easier.

Interestingly, if I had gotten a job when I dropped out (~6 years ago), I would probably be a specialist/senior engineer on some specific tool, but I wouldn't have the range of experience I do today.

Sorry if I digress, just wanted to share my non-traditional "case" (to be fair, you asked for it!)


As a former candidate now turned software engineer and interviewer, I seriously like your story and it does reflect the sad state of the tech industry's hiring process. When I need to find candidates, I usually ignore degrees or hello world based projects, but I ask for either original work or open-source contributions or features added into another project. As with your own project, I don't need to throw a test at you if you dealing with a project with advanced data structures like CRDTs, which I'm sure you already know to apply them well.

Unfortunately, this industry tends to believe that implementing something like a R*-Tree or a Van-Embe-Boas Tree in less than 10 mins is an indicator of being qualified for a CRUD application-level job. If I were hiring right now, I would preferably take on more candidates that have open-source contributions over leetcoders because with open-source, you can obviously code, use version control, do code reviews and as a bonus, you can show your work at a meetup / conference. Leetcode/Hackerrank/Codility doesn't allow you to showcase your optimal solutions and even if you attempt to, you risk breaching their plagiarism rules. So those platforms don't allow you to showcase those soft skills.

Your experience alone tells me you are already qualified for senior roles that these companies are 'struggling' to fill.


Really like your story. Thanks for sharing! Really hoping that the more engineers, like yourself, that get into organizations and spearhead efforts to reduce bias, the easier it will be for non-traditional talent to break into the field.

Best of luck in your job search, and if there's anything that you think Hatchways can do to help please let us know.


Are there any meetups in your area that are relevant to your tech interests? That might be a good way to connect to the community in person and get your foot in the door.


In my experience, you don't need to be a major contributor to an open source project to gain notice. I've only 3-5 minor contributions (work rules generally preclude me from being more active)

While my contributions haven't been large in terms of LOC, nor have I added new features, I have identified, debugged and supplied patches for bugs.

I mean, I did this out of self interest, of course.

A defect in a certain DB lib on bulk copying with nulls would fail (uninitialized memory in the C portion of the lib). That took about 6 weeks of on again/off again attention. Debugging a C module in Python is a bit of a pain in the ass.

Fixing 64-bit compatibility in a Windows ODBC C++ wrapper was another. This was a pain because it required a line by line audit to make sure the correct types were used on every ODBC call.

A problem with some inline assembly using rtdsc as a highres timer reporting 200 years had elapsed in a few minutes. This took a long while to figure out and only stumbled into the cause of the bug. I was using the timer to measure socket timeouts. We were supposed to timeout after 30 seconds, but randomly, the timeout would trigger immediately. Stumbled into it because we were using the same timer to measure database queries. Found it odd that my logs were reporting queries were taking more than 200 years to complete, as I sat there reading the logs and seeing them complete.

Another was an issue of file handles being, no pun intended, mishandled on a .Net logging lib. I forget the details on this one. Dont think the file was being properly closed at exit?

Reported an issue with Boost DateTime overflowing on certain arithmetic situations. Coworker found the issue, but I narrowed down the issue, figured out a solution and reported upstream. Finding the wrong typeset in a template zoo like Boost is an arduous task.

I'm sure there's more I've forgotten, but my contributions haven't been much in the way of LOC. My contributions have been in the hours spent and expertise in finding the typically 1 or 2 lines that are wrong.

Having experience like that on a resume (and being able to talk knowledgeably about what you did and how you do it) do open doors. Having "found and fixed obscure bug" in a widely used OSS lib is nearly just as valuable as churning out lots of OSS code. Probably more noticeable if you fix bugs in an OSS project that lots of people/companies use, rather than churning out tons of lines in a project almost no one has heard of or uses (beyond the authors).

Edit: spelling

Addendum: providing bug fixes for 3rd party libs also demonstrates an ability to work with and understand code written by someone else, which is a valuable skill in of itself.


I would add one more thing: if you contribute patches to an OSS, you are already working with people who can help you find a job and skip the HR part.


I recommend time-boxing how much time candidates will have to spend on your process. People coming from an alternate career path still have to pay their bills through their current job and tend to the same responsibilities as anyone else. Asking them to do days of unpaid homework (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16874015) may not be a luxury they can afford.

For the take-home portion of your assessment, consider paying the candidates for their time at an entry-level annualized salary. Many companies would balk at this idea because it is more expensive, but it demonstrates respect for the candidate.

Looking at the website, I don't see many details about what the assessment actually includes. I think it would help to be forthright about the structure of the assessment. Does Hatchways or the employer determine what the assignment is? How does one create a rubric for scoring a submission, and how is quality assurance conducted on the effectiveness of these rubrics?

I think it is only fair to tell candidates what area of expertise they are going to be tested on a week ahead of time, so they can prepare as they see fit. As for this bit: "ability to follow a spec, code quality and how quickly the task is completed" - it would make sense that different companies would place different weights on each of these factors, given that some of these parameters can often be at odds with each other.

Also - a particularly tricky area: how do you give feedback to candidates? Do you help them succeed? Is it enough that Hatchways gives the feedback, and not the employer to avoid lawsuits? Having done some take-homes in the past that were rejected, I received absolutely no feedback on what could have been done better or what was missing. Candidates who continually to struggle and don't pass any of the interviews aren't necessarily morons or inept - they just need someone to point them in the right direction.


Great points and comments here. Few things to add: -one big benefit for our candidates doing our take-home project is that they only need to do one assessment that can they qualify them for dozens of companies. Rather than have to do 5-6 different take-homes for different employers. -Before a candidate begins an assessment we are very upfront with what knowledge and skills you will need before you start. If there is any way we can make this clearer, we'd definitely be open to feedback -At the moment, it is quite manual how we match employers to the right candidates (we usually do this by fully understanding what the candidate will be doing on the job and helping them prioritize the right skills based on that) -We try our best to give feedback to every candidate that comes on to our platform- regardless if they make it through the assessment or not. In particular, candidates who do interviews with employers we are very active with asking employers for feedback on a candidates interview performance so we can deliver more candid feedback than they could give.

Very much agree that candidates these days are not receiving candid feedback that they can action on after they interview with employers, and this is a whole other issue that needs to be solved.


Hey Jaclyn, glad to hear you're tackling this space - one that I'm passionate about. Congrats on the launch!

"As a new grad without relevant work experience, or as a career shifter without a relevant degree, getting a first job is very painful" - Absolutely true.

I've spent a good chunk of the past few months mentoring a cousin to help him get his first job in Tech. He studied computer science, has a great GPA, can actually build stuff, but went to a not so well known college in California and didn't have any top tech company internships under his belt.

Very few companies responded to his applications (< 1% positive response) and he really had to hustle his way to get noticed (cold emails, milking his and my personal network for introductions to engineering managers, etc).

Companies like TripleByte seem to have shifted more towards the senior software engineer category, so I see tremendous value in targeting entry-level positions.

Questions: How do you plan to effectively source candidates that are able to pass your assessment? I think an interesting starting point would be to work with graduates of not well-known computer science programs. I think people generally under-estimate the difficulty of getting foot in the door at reputed Tech companies, when you didn't study at a top 10 CS program, and they would probably be the closest group, on average, to passing your technical assessment.

In my conversations with fast-growing companies in the Bay, I got the sense that the demand for senior software engineers far outstrips demand for entry-level / internship positions. Have you noticed the same trend, and as a result are you working mostly with already established larger companies?

Congrats again. Always happy to see more people tackle this problem. We need to create a more accessible, meritocratic pathway to work in Tech.


Hey there, thank you for sharing your cousin's story.

I think you're definitely right that a great place to target are programs outside of top 10 CS programs. I do believe we could bring the biggest benefit to these new grads. Do you have any suggestions on how to best reach these types of candidates?

We have also seen similar sentiment toward senior software engineers. I think something we've also noticed though is that there is such a demand for talent, that we've actually been able to convince employers to hire high potential candidates with no experience even though they were initially looking for a candidate with 2-3 years of experience.

Today, we actually focus on startups that have a challenge hiring themselves (i.e. because they lack large budgets and/or brand name), and so hiring "undervalued" talent is actually a great way for them to attract and hire talent!


> Do you have any suggestions on how to best reach these types of candidates?

Perhaps a combination of creating high quality content hyper targeted towards this audience to help them identify companies to work at, prepare for interviews and how to apply & reaching out to programming student organizations, and CS administrations at these schools to set up workshops, etc. Attending career fairs could also be fruitful (or even better, setting up great virtual career fairs for these schools)

College administrators are incentivized to work with you - the more of their students get placed at companies, the more valuable their program becomes in the eyes of future students. E.g. my college used to heavily market av. starting salary and % students placed at graduation.

> so hiring "undervalued" talent is actually a great way for them to attract and hire talent!

This is interesting. I buy that startups without a recruiting brand want to hire undervalued candidates, but I'm skeptical of their demand to hire undervalued AND entry-level candidates / interns, given their stage where they likely need more execution power with less time spent on mentorship / ramping up. Curious to see how targeting this segment pans out in the long-term, but I'm sure with effective sourcing and screening, you can shift the company segment if need be.


Great ideas-- never thought about virtual career fairs, but that sounds very interesting.

You're definitely right that undervalued AND entry-level candidates is a hard sell most of the time-- but more employers need to start giving out work experience rather than just expecting 2-3 years+ work experience. So hopefully we can find more unique ways to help solve this "experience gap" problem as we grow.


The best thing that I can think of is to reach out to all the different colleges and universities and see if and when they hold any sort of career fairs / career information sessions for their about-to-graduate students. There are also career fairs that are more general (not associated with an educational institution, but a city or a state/province).

I wish you all the best with Hatchways 'jaclynmling .


I have seen this in Amsterdam. The amount of rejections I got because I am not senior enough (despite it not being mentioned in job applications) is staggering.


FWIW I got my first job through Triplebyte when I was 19 just out of high school with nothing on my resume but two internships, so it can still be extremely useful for new engineers.


This looks like a great way to help people without a traditional background, I love it!

One question: Do you help employers pick an appropriate salary that is not abusive but reflects the candidates lack of experience? I ask because I myself hired a career transitioner and I had no idea what a fair wage was to pay her, and neither did she. We eventually settled on a number that worked for me and her, but I still have no idea if it's fair.


We do help employers gage appropriate salaries. We place candidates into tier levels based on a.) how well they did on our online assessment and b.) if they have any relevant work experience-- the tier levels relate to salaries that would be appropriate. This also allows employers and candidates to have the right expectations before walking into interviews.


I always thought the tech industry would benefit from probationary hiring/apprenticeships to help counter the challenges in technical interviewing - basically this same approach as internships but for experienced professionals.

Would you expand your program to include those experienced in the industry who don't (or won't) perform well in traditional tech interviews?


We believe that trial employment at any level is effective and beneficial to both sides. For candidates it allows them to get a better feel of the work before committing, and for employers, you get a better sense of the person's skill level in your environment. We personally have hired senior engineers doing part-time trials, and this has been effective for us. This is something we could possibly expand into in the future.


I really wish you all the best. A large part of our team at RedCarpet was hired this way. The biggest thing that it helped was to not depend on signalling from the big name universities in India (the IIT, etc).

We are proud that we did this and is now part of our company culture. The internship program is core to our people ops and everyone in the company participates.

We call it the ROCKS program - https://www.redcarpetup.com/rocks/

Today our success rate is 100% placement - either at RedCarpet or other startups in India. From what i hear, our internship program is now used as signalling by others (without depending on college name branding)

Joke : we internally describe the ROCKS program as "its like Lambda School, except people get paid to learn and get a job". Feel free to steal that ;)


Appreciate your comment! Will look more in-depth and perhaps reach out in the near future to pick your brain further (probably after the yc demo day rush though :P)

Great website and mission. Wishing you all the best too!


This is great - what you guys are doing particularly hits home for me.

I graduated out of UC Riverside, with a degree in Accounting, and if any of you are Asian-American in California, you'd know it's infamous nickname: University of Chinese Rejects. I'm willing to bet that my GPA was even lower than yours Jaclyn.

I managed to finagle my way into a UX/UI position at a major consulting firm and before that STRUGGLED to get nearly anybody to take me seriously. There's a lot of parallels to draw with Design to Engineering, most employers there are already making hiring decisions based on portfolio and aptitude, rather than grades. But still, the same platitudes of: great undergrad/masters, brand name companies, extroverts, etc all ring true. You're often focused on gaming the interview process and saying the right things, rather than being assessed as a measurement of your actual work output.

Anyway, the only way I got noticed was doing what you guys are offering as a much more legitimized service. I had to create major projects for myself that would demonstrate I had some literacy in how work would actually be done in the field, cold email + network with a bunch of companies just to get a foot in the door, create a portfolio without any help.

I think I'm one of the few that got extremely lucky in the end, but it really warms my heart that you guys are providing a service that really formalizes the career shifting process. I'll be rooting for your guys' success.


Thanks for sharing your story. Glad to hear you were able to overcome the traditional barriers. Great idea to explore design as an industry we can expand into in the future!


This seems to have tremendous potential. I like the conscious effort to de-bias the system away from initial indicators (like school, GPA, etc.). Thank you for doing this!

Question -- is there the possibility of an income-share model here? i.e. Hatchways does due diligence in initial assessment + matching and even pays for the candidate's internship at the company, and makes money only when the candidate gets a full-time offer as a pre-agreed upon percentage of the candidate's salary (for the first N months say).


We definitely think there is a huge value add to do an ISA after an internship-- which can further show our conviction of our candidates to employers if we are willing to up-front salaries.

We have in the past been able to receive government funding for some candidates that proved really positive for both candidates (received opportunities that they may otherwise not have had) and employers (to take more chances)


Thanks for starting this Jaclyn.

I come from a non-traditional background. More than 10 years ago I started a niche community that grew at its height over 1.5M/monthly visitors. Everything custom built in PHP.

Then I co-founded a SaaS analytics service which we ran for 5 years.

In 2017 I started a solo project while learning Node.js, Vue.js, Postgres, microservices, to keep myself updated.

I decided that I wanted to join a team after going solo for a while and to progress my professional career. However having no CS degrees I lack foundational programming skills. I only know the stuff that I come in contact with so during interviews, sometimes I can't answer seemingly basic programming questions. I always focused on implementation and having limited time, didn't look for the why.

I'm falling between junior and senior experience and I feel companies have no clue what to do with me.

At the moment I'm learning advanced JS concepts, programming paradigms, data structures and algorithms, and plan to open source a project that shows all that. Showing my portfolio with projects is not enough for the roles I'm looking for.

I probably lack interviewing skills. So thanks for creating hatchways, I might use it in the future. From a hiring perspective, hiring full time based on a couple interviews is super risky. I actually like to work freelance/intern before committing myself - culture works in both ways. This is obviously a privileged position if you have time or money.

I like the idea of the hiring manager/interviewer being more of a coach during the process, and tailoring the process towards different personalities/situations.


Hey Jaclyn -

I think this is amazing! I'm all for challenging the existing recruiting status quo! I personally found it extremely difficult to pivot out of one industry and trying to break into another. I went through the standard process of getting a degree, doing internships, maintaining GPA, and receiving an offer upon graduation. When I graduated, my target industry essentially cratered, my offer was rescinded, and I was a bit lost. After some research/self-prep, I decided that the tech sector was where I wanted to be. After doing a temp stint in IT admin, some MOOC’s, and personal side-projects, I still found it extremely challenging to pivot into. I didn’t know what else to do other than to go back to school and basically go through the exact same funnel as before, which is what I ended up doing. This isn’t a feasible option for a lot of people and I think one (of many) ways your platform provides value is accessibility.

That being said, I had a few questions from both a candidate’s and employer’s perspective:

- How does Hatchaways compete with the timelines of the conventional recruiting method (i.e. ~1-2 months vs your model of interning)?

- If a candidate realizes that the opportunity may not be a good fit (from his/her side), will Hatchaways connect them with another prospective employer for another Hatchaways recruiting cycle (i.e. internship) once the first one is complete?

- How does Hatchaways enable employers to assess multiple candidates for the same position at once?

- Is there a penalty to employers if business needs change halfway through the assessment (i.e. the job that the candidate is being assessed for no longer exists)?

- How are employers affected when a candidate begins an internship part of the way, only to get a full time job at another company?

Would love to chat more about this and I’m really excited to see where you take this!

Best R


I was really touched to read your story. Thank you for sharing your challenges, and particularly around how you felt the only other option was to go back to school just to get the opportunities one would get by being a 'student'.

Here are answers to your questions:

-Most of our candidates will receive an offer in less than a week since we are able to shorten the interview cycle

-Yes definitely-- if a candidate doesn't like where they interned at, they are always welcome to come back on to our platform to get matched with more employers for a new internship

-We usually match employers with 2-4 candidates we think suit what they are looking for. We get them to interview them back to back (similar to the Waterloo co-op system) so they can evaluate and interview fairly, as well as make a decision quickly (hopefully by the end of that day)

-There is a penalty if an employer provides an offer to a candidate and in between the time they make an offer and the start date-- they pay half of the entire internship salary to the candidate

-Good last question-- this has not happened yet with us. Most employers are actually quite open and let our candidates know that they are allowed to interview and even accept other offers. I believe that most employers at the end of the day only want to hire candidates who want to be work for them, so if they are curious about other companies and want to take another offer, it probably wasn't a good fit to start with!

Thanks so much for your feedback, would love to answer any more questions you might have!


Thanks for the quick reply. Had a few more questions, out of curiosity!

- Does Hatchaways provide support to candidates with regards to salary negotiations? A common method is to have multiple competing offer and it may be difficult for candidates to go through conventional interviews when they are going through the more immersive Hatchaway cycle.

- Does Hatchaways provide health insurance to candidates while they are in the 'internship-phase' of the recruitment process to full time?

-- R


- we generally give an average salary to expect depending on your skill level/ experience level, so both the candidate and employer going in with a similar expectation.

-at this time we don't offer health insurance but some of our companies still do during the 'trial phase'. It's something worth thinking about for the future though, thanks!


As someone who has been a non-traditional candidate in the past, and also leveraged non-traditional candidates as an employer, this is amazing. Thank you for doing it! I would have used this myself in the past, and I'm confident that both sides of your market will find huge value in this!


Really appreciate that you, as a non-traditional candidate, promote non-traditional hiring now that you are an employer!


This is such a great idea! Thank for you doing this :)

I also came into tech from a non-traditional background and I struggled at the beginning to get my foot in the door. I studied math and econ in school, and even though my passion was writing software, it was hard to start applying without any projects or connections in the field.

To find a job, I spent money on a coding bootcamp post-graduation from college. This seemed like the only option at the time. If there was something like this at the time, I would have rather have gone that route instead.


Thanks for sharing your story. I hope your career transition has been rewarding since!


"Mainstream hiring processes are biased towards those who went to great schools, had high GPAs, are native-English speaking, have worked at brand name companies, are extroverts and great networkers, etc. But there are so many talented people who don't fit that profile. We're excited to work on ways of hiring that give them a better chance." This really struck a chord. All the best!


I just signed up for Hatchways and filled in the profile. The next step says to do the assessment but that completing it within 24 hours would improve chances greatly. It's not clear in the instruction:

- Has the timer already started or does it start once I click on the [Start] button?

- Am I coding this in some sort of in-browser environment or am I creating a repository from scratch and submitting some sort of link?

- If the answer is the second, can I just use my own boilerplate? (ex: I want to do frontend and would just use my own boilerplate of React+SASS+Flow+Redux+etc. and ESLint+Prettier+stylelint)

- Lastly, my previous question makes me sound more experienced. However, I'm in a very odd spot. CS degree but switched careers to teaching over half a decade ago. I'm trying to switch back now but have no real experience other than being self-taught. I'm basically switching careers. Have you considered partnering with the various development bootcamps to tap their talent pool? How about partnering with online programs?

I think what you're doing is great. I hope you're able to make a real change in the tech industry.


Thanks for your comment. To address your questions: -no the timer does not start until you hit 'start' button! -you are coding in your own environment an uploading a zip file once you're done -Naturally, we have definitely a large in flow of candidates from bootcamps. We don't have any formal partnerships yet though. Would love to eventually see how we can partner with online programs as well.


Thank you for the quick reply!


This is really great, and I wish this existed 6+ years ago while I was transitioning careers. I graduated from a "name brand" university with a Stats degree, but no relevant work experience, and no desire to pursue what most of my classmates were doing (actuarial exams, etc.)

I liked assembling computer hardware when I was younger so I ended up getting my A+ certification and started working in IT help desk, eventually doing more sysadmin work, but still felt pretty unfulfilled. I couldn't afford to take the time off a full-time job to do a bootcamp or something similar, and almost took a combined work/training gig (which would have been something like a 60% pay-cut for 2 years -- in retrospect, this was totally exploitative and a terrible offer, so I was right to be reluctant).

I told my then employer about the offer and leveraged it into a lateral move into their QA dept. After doing the job for a bit and learning the basics, I read online that people were automating the checks I was performing manually. I started spending as much time as I could (and several months of extremely late nights) learning how to code. Once I knew enough Ruby to be dangerous, it was a gateway to new and better offers until I found myself doing regular old Software Engineering. I was lucky to be given some great opportunities and tenacious enough to lateral my way into the career I wanted (at past jobs I would spend a chunk of my time unsanctioned working on various software problems that the company had, only to turn around and say "look what I built, could you give me a job doing this full-time?") but had I not already been in a field where I was working with developers and with computers every day, it would have been 10x harder to make the lateral moves that I did.

Anyway, that's my nontrad story. I think the best time for me to have joined a program like this would have been at the moment where I was doing lots of webdev side-projects but no "real life" problem to solve using the theoretical skills I had gained. It worked out for me in the end, but something like this could have definitely made my circuitous path a lot more straightforward.


This is wonderful. Hopefully, I won't need to engage in as many of the obligatory endless internship applications.

Here's a some papercuts I found: some of the longer input field labels flow into the input text on my Moto G5 ("Explain a barrier...", etc.) as do some longer placeholders, and the save notification banners close fits neatly under the chat button. In addition, it took me a moment to parse the education section of skills: it isn't immediately obvious what a current student should put in the fields. It should also be possible to save filled fields in profile despite not filling out all mandatory fields.


Love this idea: closing the experience gap which makes it ridiculously hard for many talented graduates to land at their first job.

You should beware of MacDonalds and Starbucks though as soon as they start feel feel shortages ;).


More power to you and your kind!

I have been trying this model in India, along with a few of my friends/peers - to hire for junior/intermediate roles and found a great deal of success.

Experience and capability, in a way could be seen as having parts - [ ~30-40% {generic tech, domain, soft-skills}, ~70-60%{contextual knowledge and experience on the product/stack/domain} ]

The former comes from past work experience; the latter part - which is more crucial to achieve successful outcomes from intended role, is gained only on the job.

And thus IMO internship/apprenticeship model works really well.


Looks great. Signed up as an employer. I couldn’t see it on the site on mobile, but is there any info on pricing or locations covered? (I’m in Chicago)

(And bu signed up I mean I followed the “contact us” CTA)


Thanks for signing up! We're still working on the dashboard side for employers so I'll be contacting you shortly to set up a meeting to share more.

High level-- we're trying to appeal to startups so our fees are much more accessible than traditional agency/recruiting fees!


Your story really resonated with me, because of how similar it is to my own. I also graduated from Canada with a subpar gpa, and struggled a lot finding employment. In the end doing grad school in the US is what opened many doors into the tech industry for me, but I wish I hadn't wasted so many years looking for jobs between undergrad and grad school. I think your startup will do a lot of good in the world. Best of luck!


Thank you for sharing and it sucks that you feel you 'wasted' years. I'm glad you found your way into tech and wishing you the best as well :)


I don't mean to be critical of the other startups coming out of YC 2019, but some of the problems they are solving are so niche that they don't even register beyond metropolitan cities like San Francisco.

This is a difficult problem to solve because we've heard 100s of times about how hiring is broken.

The problem also scales beyond software engineering jobs because shitty hiring processes exist across most industries.

I hope you guys succeed, just so that you can show the world that hiring doesn't need to be the shitty (and sometimes elitist) process it has become.


Thank you for this.

It's a very difficult problem to solve because many employers are stuck in their own ways and going to go to big /enterprise companies and telling them they can't look at resumes if they work with us is usually an easy no for them. But we're hoping that if more and more startups work with us and if we can prove that this model is more effective for growing tech startups than hopefully, the big guys will latch on too.


I love this idea. I struggled to get my first job because there seemed to be a "people skills" craze at the time which meant that my coding skills were being less valued by companies. I felt like I was interviewing to be an actor in some of them. So I like the idea of perfecting interviewing to select on what is really required.

1. How do you compare to Codility which also does the same kind of thing?

2. How do you convince companies to take on interns?


Great questions.

1. Codility (to my knowledge) skews more short coding challenges, whereas ours are more practical project-based assessments. We're trying to assess "can you build" versus testing computer science concepts 2. A few things have worked for us. One big thing is to position our candidates as fully capable of receiving full-time offers, but that if they move quicker (via one interview then an internship offer) you can sign with them quicker than they would finish up their full-time interviews, or else they may miss out on great talent. The other, is this "try before you buy" mentality around lowering the risk for full-time hiring. They already do it with students, why can't they do it with non-students?


I would much rather do a day of work than jump through abstract technical tests and non real problems.

You could add a point for each of:

1) quick setup

2) selected a bug and started working on it

3) wrote a test or two

4) solved the bug

Extra points:

5) made the codebase better

6) asked questions

7) etc.


Hey Jaclyn I launched a website for bootcamp and self-taught coders last week: https://www.nocsdegree.com

It was top here for a few hours last Tuesday https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20506945

So maybe we could team up some way :)


Hey Pete this is great! Thanks for sharing. I'll reach out. Would be awesome if there was some way to help each other :)


Ooops! Didn't see this. My email is pete@nocsdegree.com :)


Hello Jaclyn!

Hatchways sounds awesome. I hope you don't mind, but I sent you a message on LinkedIn regarding utilizing Hatchways. I could not PM you on here and my question revolves around a story that I would prefer to be kept private. Huge shoutout to everyone posting their non-traditional stories in this thread, by the way!

I hope to hear back from you, Thanks, and keep doing great!


Thank you for your note on LinkedIn. I hope one day you'll come back and share your non-traditional story as well!


Glad you're working on this!

I'm an experienced developer from a more traditional background - do you ever foresee the internship serving as a _mutual_ vetting process? I'd love to be able to experience a company from the inside before jumping from candidate to full-time employee.


I do think there is huge value in internship/ trial employment at all levels. We've personally hired a senior engineer this way-- she was working full-time and trialed with us for a few hours a week so she could get a better sense of our environment and team, while we could also assess her skills and fit. It worked out great, and hope more employers/candidates can view this process as a mutually beneficial vetting process.


Hey Jaclyn, congrats on launching this - I think it's a wonderful idea.

Are you based in Canada / Toronto? I'd be happy to meet you and give you some suggestions based on my experience, if you visit the Bay area. My email is my HN username at gmail.


If someone from a foreign country, say Norway, contacts you about wanting your help to get a job, do you also help those candidates through the process of getting a green card?

If so, awesome! If not, that’s an idea for possible improvement right there :)


This is great point! At this time unfortunately, we don't have the capacity to make that happen, but we are looking into partnerships to help make that possible for foreign workers


This is cool, and might be useful to a friend of mine with a non-traditional background. But your company's blog is very focused on Toronto - do you all have relationships with NYC companies?


We initially launched this in Toronto and have recently expanded into major US cities like SF and NYC


Hi, I wish you the best of luck. The market skews so hard to seniors, and certain locations prioritize certain schools, it's really amazing.

I hope you expand into Seattle soon.


This is wonderful! Do you match with employers that offer visas to potential migrants? I feel like not enough platforms focus on this.


In some cases employers we work with are very open to offering visas for potential migrants, but because we mainly focus on startups at the moment this isn't super common (yet!)


Finally someone is going to solve one of the major problems of IT matket! Good luck, I'm sure you'll succeed in that!


How do you onboard ladies (companies)? This seems like potentially one-sided market.


Right now we mainly onboard employers manually, and hoping to create the other side of the market in the near future.


I think this is good and would be interested in trying some hiring via you.


That's great to hear - send us a message at hello@hatchways.io and we can set up next steps


I would like to point out that many people give online assessment tests in groups (cheating). Each person solves one question for the interviewee. That is how most people get jobs. So, assessment tests should be conducted onsite and not online (If possible).


Yep definitely a fair point. Our assessments are building out full projects (so it's less easy to share answers/ get one person to do one question and another person to do another).

Secondly, we do meet each candidate for a 1-hour virtual call as well just to ensure their skills in person align with those online!

We just know candidates are more comfortable completing assessments in their own environment (which is what they would be doing on the job anyway) so we don't want to dock out points for people who get anxiety for onsite tests.


Looks good - glad interns are getting paid!!


I love it! Skin in the game.


love the website design! adding it to my "Webspiration" folder.


Thank you :)


if a candidate didnt get through the traditional method (including multiple interviews and code assessments) then maybe they're just not the right fit for that specific job...why prolong the process even further?


Hatchways thesis is that the traditional method (multiple interviews and code assessments) sucks for screening talent.

Here's an analogy. The current method is like qualifying for a marathon by having candidates run a 100m sprint. A better method is using a half-marathon as the qualifying test. Great marathon runners will probably pass both the 100m sprint and half-marathon tests. That said, some pretty good runners will fail the 100m sprint but pass the half-marathon test with flying colors.

Hatchways is changing the qualifying criteria from 100m sprint to a half-marathon so more people can qualify for the race!


Love this analogy. Everyone showcases their skills in different ways, and we definitely want to help more people shine in whatever run they perform best in.


I would guess in most cases candidates can't fully be their authentic self or perform at their best during the interview process, so for me I'm not sure I can boil it down to "fit".

Our hope is that we can remove the traditional method so candidates don't need to go through a lengthy process as a whole, and instead get on the job as quickly as possible via one interview!




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