On: Firebug Metamorphosis

[rhodimus]

I can only speak for the Chrome/Safari WebInspector, and they're good, but I find myself going back to Firebug if I have to do any serious debugging - personally I find there to be a big step up in usability with Firebug meaning I can work faster.

It'll be interesting to see what happens to development tools when Firebug goes cross-browser.

[masklinn → rhodimus]

> I find myself going back to Firebug if I have to do any serious debugging

Why? What difference do you see between the browsers debugging-wise?

[rhodimus → masklinn]

> Why? What difference do you see between the browsers debugging-wise?

Feature-wise, very little. But as I said - I do find I can work faster with Firebug - I much prefer the the DOM inspector (one click node editing, css editing, the fact that it live updates the DOM as it is changed via any JS running on the page) and the console (DOM/JS object inspection and having XHR logging in the console itself and not on another tab). Plugins such as FireQuery also make a difference for my needs.

[masklinn → rhodimus]

> one click node editing

Yes the Webkit DOM inspector lacks that.

> css editing

It does have that on the other hand.

> the fact that it live updates the DOM as it is changed via any JS running on the page

My DOM inspector does seem to do that as well, though it doesn't highlight the altered subtrees the way Firebug does.

> DOM/JS object inspection

Has been in for a long time, though it could be missing some bells and whistles.

> having XHR logging in the console itself and not on another tab

Matter of tastes there, we'll have to agree to disagree as I'm not fond of this at all.

> Plugins such as FireQuery also make a difference for my needs.

Yes that I will easily give you.

[rhodimus → masklinn]

> It does have that on the other hand.

I know, but CSS editing is easier with Firebug.

> My DOM inspector does seem to do that as well, though it doesn't highlight the altered subtrees the way Firebug does.

Not nearly the in same way a Firebug does it, I find it very useful for the amount of DOM manipulation I do with JS.

> Has been in for a long time, though it could be missing some bells and whistles.

Again it's the "bells and whistles" that really make the difference for me some of the time. The less time it takes me to debug something, the better.

That said, I still use Chrome inspector on a daily basis, there's no fanboyism from my part.

[masklinn → rhodimus]

> Again it's the "bells and whistles" that really make the difference for me some of the time.

Since you haven't described which bells and whistles you think are missing, I can't exactly agree with your position.

[rhodimus → masklinn]

I'm not sure how anyone would be convinced that I find I can work faster with Firebug than other developer tools just by listing a bunch of features. shrug

[robin_reala → rhodimus]

FireQuery is seriously useful - I’m surprised at the number of web developers who haven’t used it.

[joshstaiger → masklinn]

I use Chrome for many tasks, but there are little things I go back to FireBug for.

For some reason the WebKit request explorer doesn’t show cookie headers, for instance.

[masklinn → joshstaiger]

> For some reason the WebKit request explorer doesn’t show cookie headers, for instance.

Mmm indeed, that's interesting, I'd never noticed. It shows the Set-Cookie response headers but not the Cookie request ones.

[rexyo → rhodimus]

Me too, Everybody has his or her likes.. Have been working pretty hardcore on web development for 10 years now but will stick with firefox for debugging because I use a lot of their tools, for example: Firebug, Web dev Toolbar, HttpLiveHeaders, Rainbow and a couple more superior extensions..