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Why is that an important distinction? Is forcible expulsion and dispropriration more acceptable if the people were brought to the island as slaves and laborers in the mid-1700s?



> an important distinction

That it is a distinction is important to me. Having difficult discussions is made more difficult if we obscure facts or conflate terms.

> more acceptable

I applied no normative judgement.


> That it is a distinction is important to me.

Why ?


Are you being deliberately obtuse? It's a pretty important distinction that these were not some native tribesmen with millennia of ancestral history tied up in the lands.


100s of years though, so from the perspective of an individual on the island it's exactly the same -- their entire life was on that island. So, the distinction is pointless and reeks of apologetics IMO.

"Sir Bruce Greatbatch, KCVO, CMG, MBE, governor of the Seychelles, ordered all the dogs on Diego Garcia to be killed. More than 1000 pets were gassed with exhaust fumes. "They put the dogs in a furnace where the people worked", Lisette Talatte, in her 60s, told me, "and when their dogs were taken away in front of them our children screamed and cried". Sir Bruce had been given responsibility for what the US called "cleansing" and "sanitising" the islands; and the killing of the pets was taken by the islanders as a warning."


By that logic, ethnic Europeans are the 'original inhabitants' of North America.

I'm also unclear on why you quoted what the British did in your post - how does it relate to whether or not calling those people 'original inhabitants' is misleading? Do you believe that, if the British did something sufficiently wrong to them, that calling them 'original inhabitants' will be less misleading?


Not everything is a contest. It doesn't matter how "original" natives are if they're natives.

The reason "ethnic Europeans" aren't "the original inhabitants of North America" is that European settlers violently displaced (or killed) the previous inhabitants.

Heck, the "original" inhabitants of North America (as far as we know) actually originated in what is now mostly Russia if you go back a few dozen millenia. And if you go back further than that (according to mainstream scientific consensus) we all likely originated in Africa. Defining the term "original inhabitants" as an absolute is blatantly begging the question (specifically it only works if you're a creationist).

People were subjected to physical and psychological violence to be forcibly removed from their home and birthplace. That's bad enough, no matter how many generations lived in the same place before. This isn't about who's had it worse.


So why oppose clarifications on what 'original' means in this context?


They were expelled in 1965. The current year is 2017. If we wait a few more decades this discussion will be pointless either way.

I'm not opposing clarifications. I'm opposing quibbling over the semantics of "original" as if the distinction adds anything to the conversation.

Their parents lived there, they were born there, they were violently expelled and suffered emotional abuse. The number of dead ancestors (or lack thereof) in the ground does not invalidate the suffering these people were forced to endure.


What would you call the descendant of a Frenchman who settled in Quebec during the 1600s ?

Immigrant? No. Settler? Not really after so many years.

As an immigrant, I view them as natives Quebecers.

What would you call them?


By European standards the US is mostly inhabited by non-natives. So I guess it'd be okay to forcibly expel everyone but the Natives because they don't have millennia of ancestral history?

I'd hope the more important distinction is how people are removed, not how many generations of dead people there were before them.


If a man shows up with a gun to run me off my land, it doesn't matter whether it was my father that bought it or my grandfather or my great-grandfather. What's important is the forcible dispropriation itself.

Cases like this just make a mockery of the Lockean natural rights theory of property.


I made no comment on if it was right or not, I simply maintain that there is an important distinction there.


No its not.


it's


Rather than correcting grammar, why don't you respond to the numerous rebuttals of your point of view elsewhere in this thread ?

You says its important but don't explain why, and empathise that you place no "normative judgement" on it.

Normative judgment doesn't make sense btw, judgement adhering to the norm - eh wat ? I think you meant moral/ethical.


For a conversation to happen, everyone should be on the same page. Distinction for the sake of clarity should always be welcomed and not confused with endorsing a specific action or behavior.


It doesn't really matter at all. The land didn't come with a .io ccTLD. It's dervived from a name the British chose, so it's not like they stole the domain name from those people, right?

Displacing settlers is a different question.


Still, why does the UK need a special TLD for a naval base?


IANA allows delegation of country-code TLDs for all countries and territories represented in the ISO 3166-1 standard.

The thing to bear in mind is this standard is used for a number of different purposes historically that has informed territories and other "non"-countries being added.

For example, it is used by postal services for routing physical mail. A lot of far flung island dependencies are coded individually because their mail wouldn't route through their mother country but through other ports.

The addition of "EU", while not a country, reflected the needs of the "EUR" currency code when the Euro was introduced (the first two letters of ISO 4217 currency codes are derived from the ISO 3166-1 standard).


Because the domain name system uses ISO-8859, which provides codes for "countries, territories and islands".

The standard provides codes for such places since different law often applies in territories and on islands.

(See also: UM, TW, EH, AQ, SH, SJ, and many others.)


I think you mean ISO-3166-1, ISO-8859 is a standard for character encoding eg: latin1 (which is probably why you know it).


I think you mixed up your ISOs. ISO-8859 is for 8bit character encodings.


I think the morally questionable problem is this: I am highly doubtful that the original inhabitants of the islands are receiving any revenue whatsoever from the corporation which runs .IO. At least the small pacific island nation states that have hired third parties to run their ccTLD have contracts and agreements in place for a revenue share.


Why should they get any revenue from .io? The .io is an invention of the government and has nothing to do with the original inhabitants. The "original" people were removed well before .io even existed.

Might as well demand they get paid for any inventions the military makes while testing stuff out there.

And if the British hadn't done this and gave control over to the people living there 50 years ago, they wouldn't get .io either, because they wouldn't call themselves British Indian Ocean Territories. They'd have used something reflecting the name in their language.

So again, this is a "resource" purely created by the British government being there.

Maybe it's terribly unfair and bad what they've done to those peoples, but .io doesn't figure into that at all.

Edit: I suppose if they had their own nation state, they could make some money that they couldn't otherwise. But why stop at domain names (which, again, wouldn't be .io, it'd be .cx or something for Chagossians)? They can't issue passports, a potentially valuable resource, not being a sovereign nation. They can't run "tax haven" schemes, etc. Seems like getting upset over .io itself is pointless compared to all the other stuff they could do with an internationally recognized government.


When Britain (and thus the US) decide they no longer require the island for a naval base, it will be given to Mauritius.

The .IO domain would eventually be deleted, and that territory represented under the existing .MU (Mauritius) domain.

Judging by https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.mu I don't think the Mauritian people have much benefit from the arrangements for .MU.


.SU - for the Soviet Union - still exists, I somewhat doubt that many TLDs will ever be deleted in general.


.SU is actually the only former country with a TLD still delegated, and quite a few have been removed. In recent years .AN, .TP, .YU, .ZR have been phased out representing former countries.


I am similarly outraged that I haven't had any cheques from Nominet come through the post recently and as a UK tax paying citizen I am outraged at this oversight.

I want my £10!


Are the original inhabitants of these islands still alive?



The question is NOT about the morality of deportation, but about about the legitimacy of the UK's ownership.

The only two nations that have laid claim to the territory are France and the United Kingdom. (France lost it in the Napoleonic Wars.)



Ha ha :)

Of course, the difference between the Indian Ocean Territory and India, is that people lived in India before. When the French showed up, the atolls were uninhabited.


I'd say that using the land of your own country - owned by people in your country - for military purposes, while sketchy, is definitely more acceptable than taking an island from its indigenous occupants by force. The UK ownership then seems at least to be legitimate.




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