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Provider Fighting Secret Surveillance Order Denied Access to Relevant Law (medium.com/digital-freedom)
85 points by rosser on June 24, 2017 | hide | past | favorite | 16 comments



The court is wrong that this is not a Due Process Clause violation. Secret laws are anathema to the Anglo-American view of due process. And in a common law system legal opinions are "law" just as much as statutes. Beyond that, the court's reasoning that a litigant should trust the other side's characterization of a case turns the concept of adversarial litigation on its head. It's a laughable view.


Original EFF blog post without Medium's login interstitial: https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2017/06/provider-fought-secret...


Made it to the front page for a tiny bit, too: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14565062

Hoping a good conversation about it happens this time.


This is madness. How can we have secret laws? Do we take some secret court judge's word?


We don't have secret laws, we have secret opinions on public laws.


Doesn't that have the same net result as secret law? Legal opinions lead to precedence which is basically "law" in court, no?


Yes. Opinions are important in interpreting whether or not a historical case can be interpreted as a precedent in a current one. That's one of the principal concepts in common law systems.


I think you mean "precedent" or "precedents" rather than "precedence".


I do! Thank you for the correction (no sarcasm). I had no idea.


Thanks, I've been misspelling that.


The parent should not be downvoted. He/she is correct.


Instead of an Article III court, that sounds like an ex parte conversation predating the matter, which the judge is using to decide the matter, which is not ok. If this really is required by Congress, judges ought to give serious thought to whether accepting an appointment to the FISC is consistent with their ethical duties, I.e., "A judge should not ... accept ... an appointment if the judge’s governmental duties would tend to undermine the public confidence in the integrity, impartiality, or independence of the judiciary." That article III judges are willing to administer procedure like that gives pause.


Why is this not getting press coverage? This looks like a huge deal...


Title is a bit misleading. The court didn't deny access to statute. The court denied access to opinions issued by the FISC. This is still really terrible because precedent is, in a way, just as important as statute in determining legal outcomes. But it's a little bit different than what the title of TFA would have you believe.

Yes, precedent can in some instances be considered 'law'. But to a non-legal layperson it's not generally referred to as such. Most people when thinking about what the 'law' is think about statute.

So it's still terrible, but the article headline is a bit misleading.


Seems like a violation of the 6th amendment.


Sounds draconian and unconstitutional.




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