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People who are security risks can't board.



That is complete bullshit. They not only don't need to board but if they pulled a gun the TSAs would be an unwitting accomplice in letting them reinact "No Russian" with their bullshit security theater gathering hundreds into a massive shooting gallery with no cover. Really that is why there was such outrage over the level - it illustrated vividly how the TSA failed on the most basic logical level.


This actually came up after the 2015 attacks in France. Most crowded locations became heavily protected, bags were all checked, etc. The result: a massive crowd in front of theaters, concert and sport venues, etc. Israeli consultants basically summed it up by saying that these procedures were creating massively vulnerable areas with potentially 100+ victims if a guy detonated a bomb in front of the venue.

I remember seeing a documentary showing how in Israeli airport one of the main goals was to always avoid long lines and big groups of people.


> "No Russian"

Context: "a controversial level in the 2009 video game Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2. In the level, the player can participate in a mass shooting at a Russian airport.".

Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_Russian


That assumes you have a perfect list of who's a security risk and who's not, and the TSA is not Santa. The 9/11 hijackers boarded with their real names, and in practice there are plenty of easy ways around this, like radicalizing someone.


Why does it have to be perfect? It could still be effective if it stops 50% of security risks.


Because in a free society, a system that stops crimes half of the time and arbitrarily denies people their rights half the time is considered unjust.

Would it be okay for police to stop suspicious-looking people on the streets and ask them for ID and run background checks if it caught criminals 50% of the time?


There’s no proof it stops even 2%. Anyone with a week’s preparation could defeat it. Yet the innocent will be punished every day.

Remember the German pilot who crashed on purpose? Good thing they had ids on everyone.


Well, we know screening luggage is useless too, as the TSA doesn’t catch 10% during tests.

So we should just let anyone into a plane with no screening at all?


I don't understand, if you actually assume that ID screening is actually 100% useless (in reality it probably has some reduction), you wouldn't screen at all yes.

If you disagree with the premise that ID screening is 100% useless, then dig up some evidence of its effectiveness.


As long as they have no weapons, we should let anyone on a plane that has a ticket.


How do you supposed we check for weapons? Seems like everything thinks current checks are "security theatre" and do absolutely nothing.


Showing your id does absolutely nothing to prevent weapons from getting on the plane. If you are so dangerous that your mere identity is enough to prevent you from getting on a plane, then you need to be arrested.

Identity is extremely easy to fake. If you are planning in such a way that you have a realistic chance of hijacking a plane, getting a fake ID good enough to fool the two-second check at the TSA checkpoint is the least of your problems.

There is some argument that a properly built luggage and human screening system could actually prevent weapons from making it on the plane. But ID doesn't really come into it.

But even if we can't develop a system that prevents weapons from getting on planes, it doesn't follow the id checks would be a suitable alternative.


But even if we can't develop a system that prevents weapons from getting on planes, it doesn't follow the id checks would be a suitable alternative.

I never said it was.

Everyone tells me the TSA can't even stop bombs or guns from being brought on, so let's skip that.

ID doesn't help, so let's skip that.

So my question is - do we just let people board without any checks at all?




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